I'll wait until Lance decides to put in his two cents, but the reason why he ran Stretch Time was because he was unable to reach the 4.032 BP for Hydras. I opted for Gogok instead as I use Flash and Frozen Mist.
For the spec I used, it should be superior to the one Lance ran for multiple targets, though it pales in comparison against single targets. More research will need to be done on this.
So to go into the spec I used a little more, all the focus goes into the WD/sader clustering enemies together for Flame Blade to quickly rack up stacks to buff Mammoth Hydra. Throughout the Rift, it isn't uncommon to see 200-300 Flame Blade stacks. Trash mobs and any unproblematic elites mixed in melt with ease. Frozen Mist, Flash and Arcane Orbit are all used to maintain Tal stacks. The reason why I chose those are because they take no attack turns, allowing you to continue maintaining Flame Blade stacks without stopping.
However, once it comes down to a single target, the group DPS suffers. Both the UE DH and the setup I use don't deal too much single target DPS. We can still down a GR65 RG in ~3 minutes if there are no issues stunlocking with the WD. Anecdotally, when dealing with multiple mobs, the spec I used is comparable or even better than what a UE DH can push out... based on current gear levels.
Core items:
Serpent's Sparker
Tasker and Theor
Focus and Restraint
Tal Rasha (helm, chest, belt, pants, amulet, source)
Key stats:I haven't been able to achieve this yet, but it's a work in progress
7% IAS on weapon, chest, gloves, bracers, both rings
50% pet speed on Tasker required
If you cannot get the above, you will be gimped somewhat by being forced to run Stretch Time or a legendary gem like Pain Enhancer or Gogok to meet BP requirements.
I also used 2-piece Firebird (shoulders/boots for cheat death), but optimally, I would run Nilfur's Boast and Pauldrons of the Skeleton King (potential cheat death). As a result, while I was running, I was missing a decent chunk of my single target DPS, despite Hydra being the main focus.
I don't know how many attempts Lance made for his GR65 and GR66 clears, but the GR65 I did was done in one attempt.
Go explore, guys, and come back with your experiences.
Most of the lag issues are gone since 2.2. The new file system solved most of the problems; while the game still lags occasionally, it's nowhere near as bad as it used to be.
Groups with wizards close to being world #1. Actually, they're world #2 at this point (and #1 post-patch), as a group on the Korean servers cleared a GR67 with a wizard:
Interestingly, if you check the gear, the wizard is far away from the Hydra breakpoint, so I think sacrificing DPS just to get IAS everywhere might not just be unnecessary, but even detrimental. I for one hope that not only we get back to the days of breakpoints (I never liked this when it was the case for DHs), but also eagerly wait (and are looking myself for) builds that do not rely on Serpent's Sparker. I want to do more direct damage :-)
Interestingly, if you check the gear, the wizard is far away from the Hydra breakpoint, so I think sacrificing DPS just to get IAS everywhere might not just be unnecessary, but even detrimental.
With the optimal gear, what is the sacrifice in dps you speak of to hit the breakpoint? What it requires is:
Weapon: 7% IAS, 10% dmg ancient sparker
Bracers: 7% IAS, lacuni or strikes
Chest: 7% IAS, tal chest
Gloves: 7% IAS Taskers (with 50% pet speed)
Ring1: 7% IAS, 6%CC, 50%CD, Socket Focus
Ring2: 7% IAS, 6%CC, 50%CD, Socket Restraint
The only possible sacrifice I see there is a potential 1300int from both rings. This in exchange for 33% more hydra damage, and higher flame blade stack cap (if you're using that skill).
But the real kicker is if you're not using hydra...how are you paying for whatever spender you replace it with in a world without globe docs and where a krider DH with no resource worries in the world is waiting to hop on your spot?
When you have a finite number of frames in order to complete an action you have to plan ahead of time the number of frames that animation will take as the total number of available frames for it to happen go down.
So it is simply the result of needing to make something appeal to scale continuously in a discrete setting.
I really really want to emphasize that this patch is only 2-3 days old and we start looking for all sorts of new group builds (especially think about synergies with other classes) rather than concluding that the new meta has been found and the Hydra wiz will be the one and only spec for this entire era/season. Keep an open mind!
Here's a great reminder how millions of people playing the main DPS class for months overlooked the best spec.
As you can read above you don't need perfect IAS gear it helps to push the limits and while Hydra is great I'm sure there will be tons of other builds simply because talrashas allows the diversity.
You'll find that I'm quite aware of the options for IAS. But for this particular build you do need perfect IAS to push it to the limits as it frees either a legendary gem or skill slot which is pretty big.
As for other builds I look forward to what other people come up with. Hydras is the best conclusion I can see in a world with no globe doc for infinite resource.
But for this particular build you do need perfect IAS to push it to the limits as it frees either a legendary gem or skill slot which is pretty big.
You might want to check out post #7 :-)
Yeah, they got the clear despite having lower dps, shows how much higher the ceiling really is.
Dude is running identical gear, and a similar spec, but is just running it with less actual output.
Yep. As I said earlier, it took a single try to clear GR65 for me. Basically cakewalk with regular mobs, no fishing required.
We "practiced" in another GR65 and failed by about a minute. Thing is, 90% of the Rift we didn't have a crusader (he disconnected twice in one Rift). And we still came close to clearing it.
You're going to need the IAS if you're focusing on the Hydra setup. You lose a third of your effective damage output without hitting the breakpoint.
Snapshot of the NA 4-man leaderboard at the time of this post:
Original post on the official forum, copying/pasting here:
Lance from <Dragon> and I are currently leading first and second, respectively, in 4-man parties.
Team composition:
1x ZDPS sader
1x ZDPS WD
1x UE DH
1x TR wizard
Both Lance and I ran completely different builds at the core. While he was oriented toward Meteor, I was oriented toward Hydra.
My spec: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#WQiYhc!RWeT!aZcbZZ
Lance's spec: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#UPilgS!RcYT!YZcbcZ
Variants of these have been attempted before.
I'll wait until Lance decides to put in his two cents, but the reason why he ran Stretch Time was because he was unable to reach the 4.032 BP for Hydras. I opted for Gogok instead as I use Flash and Frozen Mist.
For the spec I used, it should be superior to the one Lance ran for multiple targets, though it pales in comparison against single targets. More research will need to be done on this.
So to go into the spec I used a little more, all the focus goes into the WD/sader clustering enemies together for Flame Blade to quickly rack up stacks to buff Mammoth Hydra. Throughout the Rift, it isn't uncommon to see 200-300 Flame Blade stacks. Trash mobs and any unproblematic elites mixed in melt with ease. Frozen Mist, Flash and Arcane Orbit are all used to maintain Tal stacks. The reason why I chose those are because they take no attack turns, allowing you to continue maintaining Flame Blade stacks without stopping.
However, once it comes down to a single target, the group DPS suffers. Both the UE DH and the setup I use don't deal too much single target DPS. We can still down a GR65 RG in ~3 minutes if there are no issues stunlocking with the WD. Anecdotally, when dealing with multiple mobs, the spec I used is comparable or even better than what a UE DH can push out... based on current gear levels.
Core items:
Serpent's Sparker
Tasker and Theor
Focus and Restraint
Tal Rasha (helm, chest, belt, pants, amulet, source)
Key stats: I haven't been able to achieve this yet, but it's a work in progress
7% IAS on weapon, chest, gloves, bracers, both rings
50% pet speed on Tasker required
If you cannot get the above, you will be gimped somewhat by being forced to run Stretch Time or a legendary gem like Pain Enhancer or Gogok to meet BP requirements.
I also used 2-piece Firebird (shoulders/boots for cheat death), but optimally, I would run Nilfur's Boast and Pauldrons of the Skeleton King (potential cheat death). As a result, while I was running, I was missing a decent chunk of my single target DPS, despite Hydra being the main focus.
I don't know how many attempts Lance made for his GR65 and GR66 clears, but the GR65 I did was done in one attempt.
Go explore, guys, and come back with your experiences.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
Nice job.
So, even though it looked so at PTR end, you are not giving up on Wizz
My D3 armory
My Youtube Channel
I was actually gearing up my UE DH until a few people told me to go gear up my wizard, so I did.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
Awesome stuff! \o/
Hey how does Hydra behave in the group environment? Does it cause any lag / slow down on the other party members?
I have watched the s2 59 clear with wizard and they kept complaining about the hydra causing lag. You had any similar issues?
Thanks and Gj
Most of the lag issues are gone since 2.2. The new file system solved most of the problems; while the game still lags occasionally, it's nowhere near as bad as it used to be.
Groups with wizards close to being world #1. Actually, they're world #2 at this point (and #1 post-patch), as a group on the Korean servers cleared a GR67 with a wizard:
http://kr.battle.net/d3/ko/rankings/era/3/rift-team-4
Interestingly, if you check the gear, the wizard is far away from the Hydra breakpoint, so I think sacrificing DPS just to get IAS everywhere might not just be unnecessary, but even detrimental. I for one hope that not only we get back to the days of breakpoints (I never liked this when it was the case for DHs), but also eagerly wait (and are looking myself for) builds that do not rely on Serpent's Sparker. I want to do more direct damage :-)
With the optimal gear, what is the sacrifice in dps you speak of to hit the breakpoint? What it requires is:
Weapon: 7% IAS, 10% dmg ancient sparker
Bracers: 7% IAS, lacuni or strikes
Chest: 7% IAS, tal chest
Gloves: 7% IAS Taskers (with 50% pet speed)
Ring1: 7% IAS, 6%CC, 50%CD, Socket Focus
Ring2: 7% IAS, 6%CC, 50%CD, Socket Restraint
The only possible sacrifice I see there is a potential 1300int from both rings. This in exchange for 33% more hydra damage, and higher flame blade stack cap (if you're using that skill).
But the real kicker is if you're not using hydra...how are you paying for whatever spender you replace it with in a world without globe docs and where a krider DH with no resource worries in the world is waiting to hop on your spot?
When you have a finite number of frames in order to complete an action you have to plan ahead of time the number of frames that animation will take as the total number of available frames for it to happen go down.
So it is simply the result of needing to make something appeal to scale continuously in a discrete setting.
Take a look at the link Spideru posted. It contains all the information you need to answer all your questions about breakpoints.
Pick your poison.
Roll a DH and need to find Ancient Krider w/disc + meticulous bolts w/disc
Roll a Wiz and need to find an ancient Sparker with 7%, perfect taskers, and other perfect IAS gear.
I really really want to emphasize that this patch is only 2-3 days old and we start looking for all sorts of new group builds (especially think about synergies with other classes) rather than concluding that the new meta has been found and the Hydra wiz will be the one and only spec for this entire era/season. Keep an open mind!
Here's a great reminder how millions of people playing the main DPS class for months overlooked the best spec.
You'll find that I'm quite aware of the options for IAS. But for this particular build you do need perfect IAS to push it to the limits as it frees either a legendary gem or skill slot which is pretty big.
As for other builds I look forward to what other people come up with. Hydras is the best conclusion I can see in a world with no globe doc for infinite resource.
2% pet APS on TnT away from perfect now. Just got my IAS Focus.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
I'll have to try this spec. I think I have most of the gear needed just haven't had time to play much since season 2 finished.
It's kinda nice being able to use the gear that I've horded in my stash over the last two seasons
My Wizard (Season)
You might want to check out post #7 :-)
Yeah, they got the clear despite having lower dps, shows how much higher the ceiling really is.
Dude is running identical gear, and a similar spec, but is just running it with less actual output.
Yep. As I said earlier, it took a single try to clear GR65 for me. Basically cakewalk with regular mobs, no fishing required.
We "practiced" in another GR65 and failed by about a minute. Thing is, 90% of the Rift we didn't have a crusader (he disconnected twice in one Rift). And we still came close to clearing it.
You're going to need the IAS if you're focusing on the Hydra setup. You lose a third of your effective damage output without hitting the breakpoint.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site
Do your hydras snap shot whatever you had when you put them down? That is any buffs, breakpoints, etc? Or do they update dynamically.
Snapshot Dynamo, update dynamically with Flame Blade, Focus/Restraint, Tal stacks.
Armory | YouTube | Twitter | Clan Site