PvE "Fireman" Build (post p.13)

  • #1
    Hi Everybody!!!

    Here's a new PvE build that's based on the updated skill calculator:

    http://us.battle.net...ZRTY!aZW!caZZac

    It's usage is pretty simple. Just cast Haunt on 3-4 targets, then channel them in the face with Firebats.

    ---------

    Haunt (Draining Spirit) is a great source of secondary mana regeneration. Costing only 15 mana, and returning 30.
    [Net: 15 mana over 15 seconds]

    Firebats (Direbats) is your main dps skill. The WitchDoctor's base mana regeneration is 25 mps (yes, I pioneered "mps") while Firebats costs 27 mps.
    overall damage when using Firebats, NOT weapon damage]

    Grasp of the Dead (Unbreakable Grasp). Being that all the other skill variations fail pretty hard. I chose this to help keep enemies at "arms length". Doing so will increase survivability and the effectiveness of Firebats.

    Soul Harvest (Siphon). Strait forward heals and damage.

    Pets (Gargy and Dogs).Their main purpose is to tank. The longer they live the more they can tank (hence Zombie Handler).

    ---------

    I'm very much open for constructive criticism, but please know what you're talking about first.

    :Thumbs Up:
  • #2
    i like it. lots of survivability. i like how soul harvest is an oh shit button to get all of your life back.

    only thing i would change is haunt. after its ridiculous nerf its useless. sure you can spam it on multiple enemies and its extra dmg but its a waste of a cast or spell slot. since your going to be killing close id say alabaster spirit barrage would be better or maybe another CC. like you said you have 25 mana per second and firebats is merely 2 more then that, using firebats in the beta after the patch 13 it was still almost infinitly channelable, you can sit there for like 20 seconds channeling firebats before you oom. and getting an extra 2-3+ mana regen a second from gear will be very easy.

    the templars last ability can give him an extra 13 mana per second. so if you use that in solo its no worries. did u see the changes to zombie wall? it has a huge cool down but it does 800% dmg for the tower. its insane. but ya anyways id just replace haunt with something more tangible and your build is set for inferno :D
    "once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
  • #3
    Where did you get that new base regen amount? I know that they did a tuning pass but I hadn't seen it worked out anywhere yet, and it was 60 base regen before that seems like quite a bit lower.

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  • #4
    Quote from Damerflinn

    Where did you get that new base regen amount? I know that they did a tuning pass but I hadn't seen it worked out anywhere yet, and it was 60 base regen before that seems like quite a bit lower.


    I'm in ThE beta lol. I can see the base regen on the char page
    "once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
  • #5
    I like it, it looks like it could be the goods by the lvl required. @ GladHeHasBeta your feedback is nice to know, especially zombie wall. I overlooked that in one of my previous builds but I think I will be re-visiting that build with this information.


    Super Cop! He knows where you live, he knows where you sleep.
  • #6
    I keep wondering about something. While this may / may not be actual criticism of your build, maybe rather question, I can't help but think:
    Is Zombie Handler really that good of a passive, if you're not focused entirely on minions? +- one meat shield, does it make such a big difference?

    Maybe a switch from Haunt to Spirit Walk would work? Spirit walk could be runed with either Severance or Umbral Shock for damage or Healing Journey / Honored Guest if mana / health problems accur.
    The 3rd passive could be either Spirit Vessel or Grave Injustice, assuming Zombie Handler does not provide a critical difference.
  • #7
    If you're going to be spamming haunt on each enemy, why not consider locust swarm instead? I think it would save you some mana, especially against larger groups.
  • #8
    Quote from Sadde

    If you're going to be spamming haunt on each enemy, why not consider locust swarm instead? I think it would save you some mana, especially against larger groups.


    Yes, it's decisely better, especially since it can spread much more easily, even with the first runes (and deal 60% DPS, which is not bad at all, 81% with Searing Locusts) and he took the Vermin passive anyway...
  • #9
    Quote from DenkaSaeba25

    Quote from Sadde

    If you're going to be spamming haunt on each enemy, why not consider locust swarm instead? I think it would save you some mana, especially against larger groups.


    Yes, it's decisely better, especially since it can spread much more easily, even with the first runes (and deal 60% DPS, which is not bad at all, 81% with Searing Locusts) and he took the Vermin passive anyway...


    And together with grasp you have an extremely solid AoE combo.
  • #10
    Quote from Sadde

    And together with grasp you have an extremely solid AoE combo.


    Yeah :D

    But Grasp of the Dead is so good that even alone is an extremely solid combo :ph34r:
  • #11
    @OP: I get the feeling you like summons, which is cool, although I would suggest you remove one summon and add at least 1 utility spell. I would suggest big bad voodoo. It would boost your damage but more importantly make you a valuable ally to a team. For late game utility will probably be valued higher than pure damage. That being said, the Garg has a nice 3 second stun which makes him very useful. Perhaps when we get to see the Garg in action we will know more :).
  • #12
    Quote from GladHeHasBeta

    i like it. lots of survivability. i like how soul harvest is an oh shit button to get all of your life back.

    only thing i would change is haunt. after its ridiculous nerf its useless. sure you can spam it on multiple enemies and its extra dmg but its a waste of a cast or spell slot. since your going to be killing close id say alabaster spirit barrage would be better or maybe another CC. like you said you have 25 mana per second and firebats is merely 2 more then that, using firebats in the beta after the patch 13 it was still almost infinitly channelable, you can sit there for like 20 seconds channeling firebats before you oom. and getting an extra 2-3+ mana regen a second from gear will be very easy.

    the templars last ability can give him an extra 13 mana per second. so if you use that in solo its no worries. did u see the changes to zombie wall? it has a huge cool down but it does 800% dmg for the tower. its insane. but ya anyways id just replace haunt with something more tangible and your build is set for inferno :D


    Yea I took your advice and switched out Haunt for SB and also replaced Vermin with Blood Rit. I lose some damage but...pff whatever, now I don't have to worry about mana at all and I have a great single target skill.

    http://us.battle.net...ZRTY!aXW!aaZZcc

    With these new revisions I can almost completely focus on MF and Intel boosing gear.
    [SB cost: 29]

    Quote from Sadde

    @OP: I get the feeling you like summons, which is cool, although I would suggest you remove one summon and add at least 1 utility spell. I would suggest big bad voodoo. It would boost your damage but more importantly make you a valuable ally to a team. For late game utility will probably be valued higher than pure damage. That being said, the Garg has a nice 3 second stun which makes him very useful. Perhaps when we get to see the Garg in action we will know more :).


    Ya know I really though about dropping Gargy for BBV, but Bliz can go to hell with that 120 sec cool down shyt.

    I took your advice with Bruiser. The 3 second stun will be great for bosses.
  • #13
    Quote from ClassicWafflez



    I took your advice with Bruiser. The 3 second stun will be great for bosses.


    i would really like to know just how often he slams for that 100% dmg. because if its more then 8 seconds your way better off with the cleave rune. it does 32% dmg and can hit as many mobs as barbs cleave can. so 8 seconds of a cleave attack is better then 25% towards one enemy and then once every 8 seconds 100% dmg towards one enemy. back when it was 205% even if it was 8-10 it was still worth it for bosses/champs. but 100% just really isnt a lot unless its like every 3-4 seconds.
    "once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
  • #14
    Overall it's ok. A couple of glaring issues that, while in lower levels won't be a big deal they'll get you killed quickly later on.

    Firebats, while it does a ton of damage, won't be usable in the harder levels. It's a great spell if you can stand there and constantly cast it but from the videos we have seen, the game will get chaotic later on. You WON'T be able to stand around. Defense and avoidance/movement will quickly become the best assets. Spells that allow you to run and do damage at the same time will be king.

    In that same vein, the build has too many direct damage casting spells. Yes, two is too many. You wont be able to effectively maximize your DPS if you have skills that are just sitting on your bar unused (eg Bats and Spirit Barrage cannot be used at the same time). Your first build will put out significantly more damage than your second one because both Haunt and FB can be active at the same time. Locust Storm and Acid Cloud may not do as much damage as Firebats per the tooltip, but I'd bet they'll easily do more actual damage in game in later levels. As far as runes, Big Stinger and Burning Dogs will do huge amounts of passive dot as well. If you really want that one primary direct damage spell, SB is going to be the best option. It's not aoe, but then again you already have quite a bit of aoe with dogs, GotD, and then assuming you add LS and/or AC.

    The BR and SH combo is solid. I don't see many builds with BR as I think it scares people away, but you'll come out on the positive end when using certain spells.
  • #15
    Quote from superfula

    Overall it's ok. A couple of glaring issues that, while in lower levels won't be a big deal they'll get you killed quickly later on.

    Firebats, while it does a ton of damage, won't be usable in the harder levels. It's a great spell if you can stand there and constantly cast it but from the videos we have seen, the game will get chaotic later on. You WON'T be able to stand around. Defense and avoidance/movement will quickly become the best assets. Spells that allow you to run and do damage at the same time will be king.

    In that same vein, the build has too many direct damage casting spells. Yes, two is too many. You wont be able to effectively maximize your DPS if you have skills that are just sitting on your bar unused (eg Bats and Spirit Barrage cannot be used at the same time). Your first build will put out significantly more damage than your second one because both Haunt and FB can be active at the same time. Locust Storm and Acid Cloud may not do as much damage as Firebats per the tooltip, but I'd bet they'll easily do more actual damage in game in later levels. As far as runes, Big Stinger and Burning Dogs will do huge amounts of passive dot as well. If you really want that one primary direct damage spell, SB is going to be the best option. It's not aoe, but then again you already have quite a bit of aoe with dogs, GotD, and then assuming you add LS and/or AC.

    The BR and SH combo is solid. I don't see many builds with BR as I think it scares people away, but you'll come out on the positive end when using certain spells.


    wat?
  • #16
    Quote from superfula

    Overall it's ok. A couple of glaring issues that, while in lower levels won't be a big deal they'll get you killed quickly later on.

    Firebats, while it does a ton of damage, won't be usable in the harder levels. It's a great spell if you can stand there and constantly cast it but from the videos we have seen, the game will get chaotic later on. You WON'T be able to stand around. Defense and avoidance/movement will quickly become the best assets. Spells that allow you to run and do damage at the same time will be king.

    In that same vein, the build has too many direct damage casting spells. Yes, two is too many. You wont be able to effectively maximize your DPS if you have skills that are just sitting on your bar unused (eg Bats and Spirit Barrage cannot be used at the same time). Your first build will put out significantly more damage than your second one because both Haunt and FB can be active at the same time. Locust Storm and Acid Cloud may not do as much damage as Firebats per the tooltip, but I'd bet they'll easily do more actual damage in game in later levels. As far as runes, Big Stinger and Burning Dogs will do huge amounts of passive dot as well. If you really want that one primary direct damage spell, SB is going to be the best option. It's not aoe, but then again you already have quite a bit of aoe with dogs, GotD, and then assuming you add LS and/or AC.

    The BR and SH combo is solid. I don't see many builds with BR as I think it scares people away, but you'll come out on the positive end when using certain spells.


    Ya know I was just trolling you originally but now that I think about it....you might actually be right in regards to the idea of "unused skills"

    Switched back to Haunt: http://us.battle.net...ZRTY!aZW!caZZac

    I considered Locust but choose Haunt instead because Locus costs too much and it's a close range skill.

    I pretty much disagree with everything else
  • #17
    Quote from ClassicWafflez

    Ya know I was just trolling you originally but now that I think about it....you might actually be right in regards to the idea of "unused skills"

    Switched back to Haunt: http://us.battle.net...ZRTY!aZW!caZZac

    I considered Locust but choose Haunt instead because Locus costs too much and it's a close range skill.

    I pretty much disagree with everything else


    ya he made a good point about haunt even though it sucks complete ass alone and obviously is a waste of cast in norm-nightmare. it may be worth it when it takes 10-15 seconds to actually kill mobs. and everything else is typical superfulashitpost lolwut
    "once the pretty hardcore gamers we had testing inferno found it fairly difficult, we then we doubled it" -trolololol jay wilson
  • #18
    Maybe consider changing out Firebats for Firebomb. My reasoning behind this change would be that it will cost less mana, do about the same amount of damage (100% of weapon damage), and while the Firebats may go a farther range away from you, it still feels like it will be more of a line effect spell range, where as Firebomb will be an AOE of 100% weapon damage within 8 yards (scaling). You can also rune it for a wider radius (Conflagration) or even let it bounce and do multiple series of damage bursts (Roll the Bones), and finally, you can rune it to do an AOE DOT affect area as you probably already know (Fire Pit). Overall I feel like Firebomb will be a more reliable source of damage that costs less mana, and seems to have better runed effects than Firebats. I say it will be a more reliable source of damage allowing that a person would rune it for sure first bounces between enemy mobs (Flash Fire).

    Anyway, just a thought, good luck with your build and future with Diablo 3. :)
  • #19
    Quote from Apiarist

    Maybe consider changing out Firebats for Firebomb. My reasoning behind this change would be that it will cost less mana, do about the same amount of damage (100% of weapon damage), and while the Firebats may go a farther range away from you, it still feels like it will be more of a line effect spell range, where as Firebomb will be an AOE of 100% weapon damage within 8 yards (scaling). You can also rune it for a wider radius (Conflagration) or even let it bounce and do multiple series of damage bursts (Roll the Bones), and finally, you can rune it to do an AOE DOT affect area as you probably already know (Fire Pit). Overall I feel like Firebomb will be a more reliable source of damage that costs less mana, and seems to have better runed effects than Firebats. I say it will be a more reliable source of damage allowing that a person would rune it for sure first bounces between enemy mobs (Flash Fire).

    Anyway, just a thought, good luck with your build and future with Diablo 3. :)



    Quote from ClassicWafflez


    I'm very much open for constructive criticism, but please know what you're talking about first.

    :Thumbs Up:
  • #20
    Quote from ClassicWafflez

    Quote from superfula

    Overall it's ok. A couple of glaring issues that, while in lower levels won't be a big deal they'll get you killed quickly later on.

    Firebats, while it does a ton of damage, won't be usable in the harder levels. It's a great spell if you can stand there and constantly cast it but from the videos we have seen, the game will get chaotic later on. You WON'T be able to stand around. Defense and avoidance/movement will quickly become the best assets. Spells that allow you to run and do damage at the same time will be king.

    In that same vein, the build has too many direct damage casting spells. Yes, two is too many. You wont be able to effectively maximize your DPS if you have skills that are just sitting on your bar unused (eg Bats and Spirit Barrage cannot be used at the same time). Your first build will put out significantly more damage than your second one because both Haunt and FB can be active at the same time. Locust Storm and Acid Cloud may not do as much damage as Firebats per the tooltip, but I'd bet they'll easily do more actual damage in game in later levels. As far as runes, Big Stinger and Burning Dogs will do huge amounts of passive dot as well. If you really want that one primary direct damage spell, SB is going to be the best option. It's not aoe, but then again you already have quite a bit of aoe with dogs, GotD, and then assuming you add LS and/or AC.

    The BR and SH combo is solid. I don't see many builds with BR as I think it scares people away, but you'll come out on the positive end when using certain spells.


    Ya know I was just trolling you originally but now that I think about it....you might actually be right in regards to the idea of "unused skills"

    Switched back to Haunt: http://us.battle.net...ZRTY!aZW!caZZac

    I considered Locust but choose Haunt instead because Locus costs too much and it's a close range skill.

    I pretty much disagree with everything else


    As bad as Haunt is (I don't want to use it either), I think it will have a place.

    I'm not sure what else there is to disagree with. Firebats is a non-starter simply because you cannot move while casting. Watching the "You Will Die" videos Blizzard shared is more than enough evidence to support this conclusion. It's definitely a great spell and one of my favorites. It'll certainly do some damage in later levels, however there are several others that will do more simply because they will allow you to move and cast at the same time. But if it's something you want to give a go at, more power to you.
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