To follow the recommendations of Jay Wilson regarding Inferno- 2 defensive skills, 1 single target DPS attack and 1 AoE- there seem to be surprisingly few monk build options when aiming at maximum DPS and survival. Here's my build- http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#UeXdTk!eUT!cccccc - but you don't have to look at it to discuss which of the monk's skills will be effective enough for Inferno.
SKILLL ANALYSIS
-Out of all the skill types the generators seemed the most balanced- I could see using any of the four in Inferno.
-Besides generators, Seven-Sided Strike appears to be the monk's only true single target skill (and of course even this is also multi-target). And Wave of Light is definitely the biggest AoE bomb the monk can spam.
-Sweeping Wind is really interesting. It may not be good enough to replace SSS or Wave of Light, but if survival isn't an issue it could replace a mantra. Inferno of all places seems like where we'll be able to find an enemy to hit every 6 seconds.
-Tempest Rush and Mystic Ally don't do too much damage and in some ways seem to be more useful defensively than offensively- Temple Rush to escape a tight spot and Mystic Ally to draw them away from you. These could be useful enought to replace one of my defensive skills- we'll have to wait until May 15 to see.
-Cyclone Strike at 100% weapon damage seems like a great skill for areas you know you can handle, but a luxury we probably won't be able to afford in Inferno.
-Exploding Palm and Lashing Tail Kick I'm on the fence about- LTK might do enough damage, and I don't doubt that there will be big crowds in Inferno for EP to cause cascades in. But are they good enough to replace Wave of Light? I don't know.
Passives: I went all defensive because my mantra is offensive; with the near-constant dying in Inferno Jay discusses, Near-Death Experience at least seems like a no-brainer.
What do you think? What monk skills will make the cut in Inferno? Of course there are a ton of open variables, so we can't really know until the game is released, but honestly I'm going crazy here waiting for May 15.
Deadly Reach is going to save you from a lot of damage during combat if you're versing more than 1 ranged enemy at a time, if used correctly you can dodge ranged attacks easily.
I think Inferno is gonna be about quickness and knockback. Abilities such as Dashing Strike and LTK will be invaluable due to their low spirit cost. LTK's knockback is gonna be a life saver while Dashing Strike gives you escapability (even if its just from the big bad champion packs). Esp that knockback, if you can stop an enemy from dealing big damage when you need to youll live a lot longer.
As far as spirit gen's go, I would have to disagree with them being balanced. I think Fists of Thunder and Way of the Hundred Fists are by are the two best spirit gen's. Fists of Thunder is fast with a little aoe and there is an awesome knockback at the end. Then WotHF w/ Windforce Rune makes for awesome single dps added with a great kick of aoe. This is just my opinion but Deadly reach and Crippling wave will be awesome for lower difficulties but not inferno.
I recall that SSS takes you temporarily out of the battle while you are striking. this gives a second or so to gauge your situation and detrmine whether to; A-Dash out, B-Heal/fear, or C-Wave of light for it's damage and little knockback, or all three as a crap-I'm-trapped combo.
As the cliche goes, the best defense is a good offense.
I don't see how Near Death is anything but a skill for HC toons.
It's not helping you kill things or not die. It's letting you try again after dying, which I can run back and do.
We're all making assumptions at this point like I can't fathom how One with Everything would be left out of any build passed Nightmare.
But who knows? Maybe resist all gear is cheesy easy to get or maybe there's not as harsh a penalty as previous games. I doubt it, just saying it's an assumption.
We only need so many offensive abilities and spirit dumps.
Who knows what mantras we'll need? If I don't need to use a health one, more the better. I might need to dodge or do more dmg.
The nice thing if we have lots of time to get used to them before figuring it out. And that's point builds are like playing the lotto with no real prize.
If you read on the main page they did some maintenance. I havent checked the time but the site certainly had something happening with it before. Perhaps all the posts made during that time were removed. I couldnt even log in before.
Even us (mods/staff) has problems with login (well at least I did for a couple hours).
I think LTK will probably be better overall than Wave of Light, if anything for the sheer spirit efficiency (although WoL is probably better "burst-wise").
Near Death is kind of a waste unless you are on HC. It gives no added benefit unless you mess up, and messing up happens but is not something you should account for imo. None the less, amazing ability for hardcore, monks will prob be the first HC characters beating inferno.
Basically, i will be boosting spirit regeneration to maximize spirit dumping skills and thus healing with transcendence.
I think that WOTHF spirited salvo is some uber good generator in between fights. You can just quickly fill up your spirit and heal up between fights just by spamming the generator in thin air or so i think since spirit generation comes from activation of the skill.
Basically, i will be boosting spirit regeneration to maximize spirit dumping skills and thus healing with transcendence.
I think that WOTHF spirited salvo is some uber good generator in between fights. You can just quickly fill up your spirit and heal up between fights just by spamming the generator in thin air or so i think since spirit generation comes from activation of the skill.
Transcendence seems weak but we dont know yet, I've revised my build and am thinking something like this: http://us.battle.net...Zcgk!ZeU!aZYYZc Its mostly a mix between damage and defense I think full def is bad because you will just slowly die in inferno, and its always good to have some source of damage.
Also with the Serenity and Conviction you can deal some pretty nice aoe even though its your defensive cd. I think Reap what you sown is better then Instant karma due to Serenity only lasting 3 seconds and there being a 50% chance of instant karma procing while Reap will always do damage.
@1up_mush: I would be surprised if WOTHF spirited salvo allowed monks to generate spirit without a target, but it could be. If so that would be a fantastic choice of generator.
Obviously it will depend on how much survivability we need to tackle inferno, but in theory I really like sweeping wind. It is probably our most efficient damage dealer.
I intend to use a 2 hander to maximize skill damage, and I will be stacking crit and dex pretty heavily. With the quickening rune you should be able to build a lot of spirit pretty fast even while using 2 handers if you stack crit. I like sweeping wind because the damage with Blade Storm is quite good. It costs 75 spirit which is significant, but once it up it can stay up forever in theory. The great thing about it is that it's doing good damage without costing you any time or spirit once you have it up. So I can be building more spirit with fists of thunder or dumping spirit with lashing tail kick and on top of that be getting really nice damage from sweeping wind at the same time. Cyclone strike is there for some really nice aoe damage once I have SW at 3 stacks, but I may replace it for more survivability.
Additionally I'm not set on my mantra at this point. Since I'm stacking dex I think the dodge mantra might be pretty good and its backlash rune seems like it could be pretty good against large packs of trash.
LTK is probably our most efficient spirit dump, but most people including myself dislike the knockback. It interferes with EP and SW aoes... If there was a rune to remove the knockback I think it would be a very good ability... Still a good ability as is though.
I'm really not a big fan of seven sided strike... A lot of people are using it in their builds but the cooldown is kind of a deal breaker for me.
As I already mentioned this will ultimately be decided by how the mechanics of Instant Karma are. If the damage is reflected flat without taking armour/resistance/dodge into account it clearely is superior to Reap What You Sow despite the only 50% chance. Reap is capped by your max health, where Karma has no such limit. And if the mechanics play out this way then 170k damage reflected is always superior to ~ 5-10k damage to every enemy.
But if armour/resistance/dodge influence the reflected damage (and armour in the end reduces the damage by a lot - as we still don't know), then yes, then Reap is superior to Instant Karma.
So this is one of the skills where we clearely can't say much before release and only take wild guesses at the mechanics.
On Transcendence: Yes, this is realy a nice passive. Especially when we take into account the spirit-heal from gear. I guess only Exalted comes from Inferno, so we can have ~220 life per 10 Spirit spend (taking middle) on up to 3 items, effectively doubling Transcendence before Inferno.
Transcendence is strong but i just dont think we have the room for it, the other passives just seem stronger although I agree Spirit-heal gear will be strong
I really doubt instant karma is gonna be reflecting that much damage, and if the damage reflection is minimal is think that the increase in duration rune would probably be the strongest.
I re-looked at your build and j/w is it worth taking out are you not afraid of burst damage during cc without pacifism?
Honestly, the only passive I see being utterly useless at the moment is near death, all the others seem to be viable depending on what play style you choose for yourself. There are nice passive choices for offensive builds, dodge, sustain, tanks, spirit spenders, it really is a wide variety of choices.
As of right now we have 5 viable passives I do agree, I think its just opinion as of right now which one is better, because of course we are waiting for release.
I do like your build alot it has some solidness to it. But honestly EP is going to do massive damage in inferno. THe fact that it does 30% of the targets life to everyone around it will make it the top dog in aoe. Since inferno mobs will have TONS of hp. Wave of light is just way to much spirit to spam, unless you stack alot of spirit regen.
Breath of heaven is a huge nobrainer, easily "spammable" heal on a 15s cd. The fear rune is meh since its such a short duration, i would go the damage buff rune instead honestly.
I feel like pacifism wont be that necessary, i dont see that many mobs doing crown control on you in inferno. Honestly i would do sixth sense so you can get alot more dodge.
I probably will do a double spirit gen build for most of the game up into inferno and swap fists of thunder for dashing strike, since it ports you behind the enemy. Abusing that to get behind bosses will be priceless. Not to mention the 20% dodge rune.
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SKILLL ANALYSIS
-Out of all the skill types the generators seemed the most balanced- I could see using any of the four in Inferno.
-Besides generators, Seven-Sided Strike appears to be the monk's only true single target skill (and of course even this is also multi-target). And Wave of Light is definitely the biggest AoE bomb the monk can spam.
-Sweeping Wind is really interesting. It may not be good enough to replace SSS or Wave of Light, but if survival isn't an issue it could replace a mantra. Inferno of all places seems like where we'll be able to find an enemy to hit every 6 seconds.
-Tempest Rush and Mystic Ally don't do too much damage and in some ways seem to be more useful defensively than offensively- Temple Rush to escape a tight spot and Mystic Ally to draw them away from you. These could be useful enought to replace one of my defensive skills- we'll have to wait until May 15 to see.
-Cyclone Strike at 100% weapon damage seems like a great skill for areas you know you can handle, but a luxury we probably won't be able to afford in Inferno.
-Exploding Palm and Lashing Tail Kick I'm on the fence about- LTK might do enough damage, and I don't doubt that there will be big crowds in Inferno for EP to cause cascades in. But are they good enough to replace Wave of Light? I don't know.
Passives: I went all defensive because my mantra is offensive; with the near-constant dying in Inferno Jay discusses, Near-Death Experience at least seems like a no-brainer.
What do you think? What monk skills will make the cut in Inferno? Of course there are a ton of open variables, so we can't really know until the game is released, but honestly I'm going crazy here waiting for May 15.
As far as spirit gen's go, I would have to disagree with them being balanced. I think Fists of Thunder and Way of the Hundred Fists are by are the two best spirit gen's. Fists of Thunder is fast with a little aoe and there is an awesome knockback at the end. Then WotHF w/ Windforce Rune makes for awesome single dps added with a great kick of aoe. This is just my opinion but Deadly reach and Crippling wave will be awesome for lower difficulties but not inferno.
I recall that SSS takes you temporarily out of the battle while you are striking. this gives a second or so to gauge your situation and detrmine whether to; A-Dash out, B-Heal/fear, or C-Wave of light for it's damage and little knockback, or all three as a crap-I'm-trapped combo.
As the cliche goes, the best defense is a good offense.
It's not helping you kill things or not die. It's letting you try again after dying, which I can run back and do.
We're all making assumptions at this point like I can't fathom how One with Everything would be left out of any build passed Nightmare.
But who knows? Maybe resist all gear is cheesy easy to get or maybe there's not as harsh a penalty as previous games. I doubt it, just saying it's an assumption.
Monk defensive abilities are pimp. I'd be surprised to run without two of them.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#UZXgTk!YUZ!cabacZ
We only need so many offensive abilities and spirit dumps.
Who knows what mantras we'll need? If I don't need to use a health one, more the better. I might need to dodge or do more dmg.
The nice thing if we have lots of time to get used to them before figuring it out. And that's point builds are like playing the lotto with no real prize.
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Wise ElderI think LTK will probably be better overall than Wave of Light, if anything for the sheer spirit efficiency (although WoL is probably better "burst-wise").
Inferno transcendence monk
Basically, i will be boosting spirit regeneration to maximize spirit dumping skills and thus healing with transcendence.
I think that WOTHF spirited salvo is some uber good generator in between fights. You can just quickly fill up your spirit and heal up between fights just by spamming the generator in thin air or so i think since spirit generation comes from activation of the skill.
http://us.battle.net...Zcgk!ZeU!aZYYZc Its mostly a mix between damage and defense I think full def is bad because you will just slowly die in inferno, and its always good to have some source of damage.
Also with the Serenity and Conviction you can deal some pretty nice aoe even though its your defensive cd. I think Reap what you sown is better then Instant karma due to Serenity only lasting 3 seconds and there being a 50% chance of instant karma procing while Reap will always do damage.
This is one of the builds I will be testing: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#aZXifk!ZXU!YYbZZc
I intend to use a 2 hander to maximize skill damage, and I will be stacking crit and dex pretty heavily. With the quickening rune you should be able to build a lot of spirit pretty fast even while using 2 handers if you stack crit. I like sweeping wind because the damage with Blade Storm is quite good. It costs 75 spirit which is significant, but once it up it can stay up forever in theory. The great thing about it is that it's doing good damage without costing you any time or spirit once you have it up. So I can be building more spirit with fists of thunder or dumping spirit with lashing tail kick and on top of that be getting really nice damage from sweeping wind at the same time. Cyclone strike is there for some really nice aoe damage once I have SW at 3 stacks, but I may replace it for more survivability.
Additionally I'm not set on my mantra at this point. Since I'm stacking dex I think the dodge mantra might be pretty good and its backlash rune seems like it could be pretty good against large packs of trash.
LTK is probably our most efficient spirit dump, but most people including myself dislike the knockback. It interferes with EP and SW aoes... If there was a rune to remove the knockback I think it would be a very good ability... Still a good ability as is though.
I'm really not a big fan of seven sided strike... A lot of people are using it in their builds but the cooldown is kind of a deal breaker for me.
I really doubt instant karma is gonna be reflecting that much damage, and if the damage reflection is minimal is think that the increase in duration rune would probably be the strongest.
I re-looked at your build and j/w is it worth taking out are you not afraid of burst damage during cc without pacifism?
As of right now we have 5 viable passives I do agree, I think its just opinion as of right now which one is better, because of course we are waiting for release.
and with your last point I agree completely.
Breath of heaven is a huge nobrainer, easily "spammable" heal on a 15s cd. The fear rune is meh since its such a short duration, i would go the damage buff rune instead honestly.
I feel like pacifism wont be that necessary, i dont see that many mobs doing crown control on you in inferno. Honestly i would do sixth sense so you can get alot more dodge.
I probably will do a double spirit gen build for most of the game up into inferno and swap fists of thunder for dashing strike, since it ports you behind the enemy. Abusing that to get behind bosses will be priceless. Not to mention the 20% dodge rune.