Dual Wield or Crossbow?

  • #1
    So I'm in the process of building my legacy DH and am planning out future gear.

    I am thinking about going for one of these two options:

    1. High dex, 2-socket Manticore + high-tier Dead Man's
    2. Dual wield high-tier Danetta's set

    Assuming gold is not a problem, which would you prefer? I'm leaning toward dual-wielding because I'm going to rely on Gloom for life steal and fast dual-wield attacks and life on hit.

    Also, I don't see a lot of dual-wielders and feel like standing out.
    Blizzard Entertainment - Diablo III Community MVP
  • #2
    I think Gloom gives enough Lifesteal to make LoH unneccesary on a well-geared character, and it works fine with Manticore. But go with dualwield if you feel like standing out, because indeed very few DHs do that at the moment. My problem with dualwielding is that you burn through hatred so quickly.. although of course, you also regenerate it quickly, so it's not a big deal.
  • #3
    Ever since I changed to a Manticore and bumped my IAS to 1.6+ I never wanna go back to Bow or Xbow. Was on the lookout for a two socket Manticore but with a decent DPS/Dex setup money was a big hold back for me but was lucky enough one night and ended up with a 1198 dps, 326 dex and 95 chd with one socket Manticore which in the end gives me a more solid dps than double socket imo.

    For me go with a Manticore.
  • #4
    I'm a big fan of the Manticore, especially the 2 socket ones. Can't go wrong with a Dead Man's Legacy quiver either.

    I've seen a few dual wield DHs that have decent damage so it's really your preference.

    Gloom works fine on uber Siege (using 2 sentries; with 3 it gets tougher). I have legacy Nat's, full disclosure.
    Conform or be cast out.

    My Demon Hunter: http://tinyurl.com/anufqzj

    Demon Hunter spreadsheet by Dretar http://www.diablofans.com/topic/46517-demon-hunter-dps-calculator/
  • #5
    Danetta's set is bad, if you want to go for dualwield get calamity+danetta's spite. I'd like to try it out but I think manticore is better, couz every time you move while dualwielding you 'lose' some shots because of fast attackspeed and with slower weapon like manticore you can keep attacking while moving without losing dps. Thats imo.
  • #6
    The Reason i use a manticore is that the weap dmg on both 1h and bows are very bad. Bows = Very low min- Decent max. 1h= just dont really fit any of the skills of a dh. (imo)

    http://eu.battle.net...604/hero/197375

    I really enjoy playing 2h DH .. Seing numbers above 1mil all the time .. feeels good :D
  • #7

    Danetta's set is bad, if you want to go for dualwield get calamity+danetta's spite. I'd like to try it out but I think manticore is better, couz every time you move while dualwielding you 'lose' some shots because of fast attackspeed and with slower weapon like manticore you can keep attacking while moving without losing dps. Thats imo.


    this is the exact reason why i didnt want DW... i really considered buying calamity and another 1H-crossbow. but its harder to kite with faster attackspeed without losing dps.
  • #8
    Another point to consider: 20% bonus to attack speed (IAS) was left in the game by Blizzard on quivers exclusively. Additionally, you can get some decent bonuses on quivers to Hungering Arrow, Elemental Arrow, etc. and it's a good place to get a big chunk of Vitality (DML gives ~170-over 300).

    Skills/talents using "Weapon Damage" are probably affected as well- I haven't done the math on those (the great Demon Hunter spreadsheet by Dretar does it for me! http://www.diablofan...dps-calculator/ ). Take a few minutes to populate the spreadsheet with all of your gear. Do the Absorption tab as well; great information on where you are "Living"-wise.

    A dead Demon Hunter does 0 (zero) DPS. Once a tank gets a DH that can a) not die and B) do damage they invite you back.
    Conform or be cast out.

    My Demon Hunter: http://tinyurl.com/anufqzj

    Demon Hunter spreadsheet by Dretar http://www.diablofans.com/topic/46517-demon-hunter-dps-calculator/
  • #9

    Another point to consider: 20% bonus to attack speed (IAS) was left in the game by Blizzard on quivers exclusively. Additionally, you can get some decent bonuses on quivers to Hungering Arrow, Elemental Arrow, etc. and it's a good place to get a big chunk of Vitality (DML gives ~170-over 300).

    Skills/talents using "Weapon Damage" are probably affected as well- I haven't done the math on those (the great Demon Hunter spreadsheet by Dretar does it for me! http://www.diablofan...dps-calculator/ ). Take a few minutes to populate the spreadsheet with all of your gear. Do the Absorption tab as well; great information on where you are "Living"-wise.

    A dead Demon Hunter does 0 (zero) DPS. Once a tank gets a DH that can a) not die and B) do damage they invite you back.


    I did run a spreadsheet. After I put in some sample gear from the AH, there was a 8K-ish DPS Manticore advantage over duel Danetta's. But it looks like there is overwhelming support for Manticore (makes sense considering there is only ONE DH in the top 50 DPS for U.S. DHs that doesn't use a Manticore).

    Ah, well, this is an alt character for me anyway. Thanks for the input. I'll research some more and crunch a few more numbers before giving her the green light.
    Blizzard Entertainment - Diablo III Community MVP
  • #10
    Do not discount the LoH and lifesteal from the Danetta set....i found it a life-saver after the 1.05 reflect dmg enhancements.
  • #11

    Do not discount the LoH and lifesteal from the Danetta set....i found it a life-saver after the 1.05 reflect dmg enhancements.


    reflect damage wasn't buffed in 1.0.5.

    us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/7006893362?page=2#31
  • #12
    personally, I use a 2-socketed Manticore and switch to a 900 LoH, 3.0% LS Windforce when facing Reflect Damage packs
  • #13
    It comes down to style preferences. I use a calamity and a danetta's spite, both with 100% crit dmg gems and i love the crazy attack speed. You will get more nightstalker procs, but lose alot of vitality from not using dead mans legacy.
  • #14

    It comes down to style preferences. I use a calamity and a danetta's spite, both with 100% crit dmg gems and i love the crazy attack speed. You will get more nightstalker procs, but lose alot of vitality from not using dead mans legacy.

    Hey i just started gearing my alt DH and also got Calamity and Danetta's spite. What do you do when reflect damage comes up? Is Shadow power enough? or do you have some LOH somewhere else?
  • #15
    I ended up using a Manticore + Dead Man's. Oh, well. So far so good with the OP perma-Gloom.
    Blizzard Entertainment - Diablo III Community MVP
  • #16
    Manticore + Dead Man's for sure
  • #17
    Glad it worked out. I would say if you ever go the dual-weild route to go with a Calamity + Danetta's. I get them confused, but one of the Danetta's doesn't roll a socket or CD innately, and the damage is usually pretty low on those. If Calamities are a bit too pricey, a high-damage rare with CD and a socket will do the trick. +IAS is good to have, too.

    The main advantage of dual-weilding is the increase in APS, which can help a lot when running Gloom with Nightstalker and also Bolas with Thunder Ball. I would say it relaxes the gearing cost, since +IAS is expensive on trifecta slots, but it's also a very very good stat for DW builds, so it's not something you'd skip. The +CC on the Archery talent also allows you to stack CC higher, which helps with Nightstalker / perma-gloom - which is useful on high MP reflect mobs and seigebreaker / kulle.

    As for handling reflect with DW, if your RA and damage are high enough, it's pretty easy to just perma-gloom through it.
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