Whirlwind alternative?!

  • #1
    Hi there fellow barbs! :)

    First: sry for wall of text and no video! :/

    I just startet to get boring a little time ago with my whirl build.. been running this since dino kinda "invented" this whole thing and back in the days where rltw generated fury like hell :D

    THIS GUIDE IS FOR BARBS TO TRY OUT SOMETHING NEW IT IS NO FOTM SPEC BUT BRINGS A LOT OF FUN FOR ME ACTUALLY

    so i just tried to get a spec what fits most and is efficient, even in high mp..
    i tried skorn rend, hota smash and even a throw spec .. all gotten from forums here or battle.net
    none of them really was that what i needed.. and either felt clunky or simply not my play style..

    so i chose to get a spec myself and juggled around with all skills till i came to this:

    http://eu.battle.net...RUPQ!ZYf!abYZcZ

    ITEMIZATION?
    well i was whirl and started with exactly the same items.. it felt super smooth but the single target dmg lacked a bit so i bought 300th spear and now that isnt a problem either

    it first felt a bit wierd, cuz i am usually in the middle as a barbarian.. but after a few minutes i realized how to play this..
    starting up fury then spam throw for 1-3 mobs with some slams between..
    try to pull more as you efficiency will grow with monster numbers!
    sprint in circles and slam into mob-grps.. like stutter-stepping dh-gameplay u will run-smash-run -smash or simply smash, if you can get the mobs to one direction, avoid multi-direction fights, just slows you down!

    to get started there are two possibilities:

    1st: take unforgiving as passive an get battle rage running, then switch back,so u just have no starting issues

    2nd: get into some monsters and try to get as much fury to shout .. from here there should be never any fury issue!!

    why that skillz?
    throw: well strong damage and generates fury like hell even on a single target! (what is needed if we dont have like 5+ mobs running around + has a snare and is pushable by 300th spear!

    seismic: well one fury spender is a must for nearly every spec and this one is AWESOME! i didnt remember how good this skill actually can be.. has knockback, solid dmg, aftershocks and a good synergy with throw (cuz we dont have much room for lifesteal in this spec (i only have 3% with belt) we want everything at distance)

    br: into the fray i think i dont have to comment, passive dmg increase and fury generation what is crucial to most specs out there

    sprint: well i tried marathon but i realized i dont run so much for actually using that 5 seconds or the increased speed.. and then switched back to rltw and moar dmg + moar fury seems quite nice :)

    zerker: hm as for br think doesnt need any explanation... plain dps increase and some surv + the most needed attack speed

    op: this skill can be switched with any shout, if you want group utility or some other skill u prefer.. but killing spree offers much dps and the needed crit to generate fury faster especially with throw

    passives: dmg dmg and no escape is pretty much needed for me actually because i dont have any -fury items for throw (which you dont need and isnt recommended) so iu generate like 30fury on crit.. insane! :)

    few hints on this:
    -tried with 2h.. slow, clunky and less fury, not recommended..
    -300th spear and echoing fury is what u want for this spec! ( finally the fear is good for something!! :D)
    -fury reduce for throw is not actually benefiting you so much because u spend less fury and therefore have to cast sprint or rage for keeping wrath up (tried with ik belt -4 and wasnt happy with it)
    -get monsters to choke points or corners.. better kill speed for ckumped up things
    waller can be very nasty with this spec, watch out!
    ->only elite i faced till here which really made a problem were those frogs in act 1 with arcane fast waller mortar, everything aelse was really no problem up to mp9
    -if you play in grp: WARNING!!!! watch out if a cm wizz is ingame.. they will hate you :D
    but dhs love you for smashing like 100mobs away, thats why you eventually find me in whirl spec but normal is this one

    heres my character for reference:

    http://eu.battle.net...112/hero/627608
    just about 150k dps buffed 220 i think so no high end equip needed

    p.s.: i dont have a movie and i dont claim to have this spec invented but it was all my work this time to create this and maybe someone has go


    so long, enjoy
  • #2
    you should throw those lacunis in the garbage bin, you don't need more than 24% MS
    Make your peace...Quickly!
  • #3
    It might be worth changing your thread title since it looks like you're asking for help rather than offering a guide. :)

    Here are my thoughts with the caveat that I've not played weapon throw myself:
    1. You should be able to pick up lifeleech (plus socket and strength) on your EF without too much trouble. It probably doesn't matter until you start pushing high MP though. At that point, reflect damage becomes a problem for most builds without at least 5ish LL.
    2. I won't go into a lot of detail on your gear (unless you want me to, I would definitely make some different choices especially by crafting), but I notice that you currently have 36% movement speed from items but the cap is 25%, so 11% of it is wasted. I'd drop the Lacuni's for crafted bracers with crit chance / resist all / Strength (and vit if you get a little lucky) if it were me. If you're just running them for the attack speed, you can offset that on jewelry if you think it's needed for the build, though I suspect you'd be better off with more crit chance / damage.
    3. Have you considered Ancient Spear: Rage Flip? I haven't tried it myself, but the older weapon throw builds swore by it for high damage, mob placement and the bonus from No Escape which you're already running. Basically,whenever you hit Ancient spear (and aren't trying to reposition the mob) you just spam the button a few extra times and since crits reset the cooldown, sometimes you get 2-5 of them off in rapid succession for big single-target damage and bonus fury.
    ...and if you disagree with me, you're probably <insert random ad hominem attack here>.
  • #4
    hm ok my gear may not be optimal for this.. but i dont have any problems with reflect mobs even on mp10.. and yes you're right i should change topic to "here is an alternative for ww" :/
    but i dont want a throw spec.. you just misunterstood me.. due to monster density it is required to have a mass aoe spell for cutting down the hordes.. i currently play on mp9 in grps mp10 (but as i said many cm wizz there so switching to ww with hammer:smash often)
    throw is just your "ranged primary" so to say and used vs less than 5 mobs

    to my lacunis.. i know it.. just as i said its my ww gear with a spear upgraded..
    for my lifesteal i got no money (got 12m atm i think) cuz im looking for big upgrades on dps.. dont now if i should craft much?!

    but i wanted to inspire some barbs who may have the same problem like me and searching for an alternativ.. and i admint it isnt much less efficient than ww spec (maybe just a feeling) but brings a ton of fun into gameplay

    hope just some guys try this and think "wow thats really fun" cuz the main thing is seismic slam with its rumble effect and this awesome feeling when the whole screen shudders and hammers and you just seeing much numbers and monsters falling :)

    gear advices are welcome (but low budget as stated)

    but thanks for comments so far
  • #5
    To be clear, when I suggested trying Ancient Spear, I'd probably drop Overpower rather than Seismic Slam. I recognize that SS is core to the build. :) Also, since AS is a fury generator, it might reduce your dependency on Unforgiving to get started (or if you accidentally run out of fury) if you care about that and give you another tool vs. single targets. Since you keep enemies away with SS and weapon throw, it just seems like Overpower is a bit of a waste, excluding the crit buff.

    Gear wise, I'm a little less familiar with small budgets, but I'll give it a shot. I'd probably start by replacing the bracers, amulet and then shoulders with crafted versions (the ones that require Demonic Essences and they should all be Strength recipes) roughly in that order. Once you get decent items in all three slots, I'd probably focus on crafting amulets until you get one that's really amazing (like crit chance 5+, crit damage 80+, avg damage 40+, 300+ strength as an example).

    I'd probably also look into an IK chest which would free you up to run a Witching Hour belt for more DPS. I'd also try to pick up crit damage on the gloves, and the ring as well if you can fit it into your budget along with crit chance (high min-max damage is also great on rings and I don't know if you can afford all three there or not). Alternatively, a cold damage SOJ would be good if you can sustain ToC with the loss of crit chance and have a few million gold for a decent one.
    ...and if you disagree with me, you're probably <insert random ad hominem attack here>.
  • #6
    well all items you listed in this will result in a loss of resist/vit/armor for me and about 600 is i think a sweet spot.. turning my ik belt would turn my life steal to zero i was looking for one with decent str vita the last days but too expensive..
    amulet is a hard thing.. i realized it isnt that amazing.. but giving the fact it boost about 250 vit it is crucial for my hp (40k isnt that much)
    so i have to resocket vit.. oder find vit crafted shoulders.. same goes for ik chest mostly high str but high vit on top is very expensive
    but as you said maybe i just start crafting items vit shoulders should be a good start then?

    about the ancient spear thing yes i got it in the past and as i said, overpower can be replaced by shout or in this case by spear, and good point at initial fury gen but warcry would have fit the same and better i think in overall scenario
  • #7
    Quote from Ragnakh

    well all items you listed in this will result in a loss of resist/vit/armor for me and about 600 is i think a sweet spot.. turning my ik belt would turn my life steal to zero i was looking for one with decent str vita the last days but too expensive..
    amulet is a hard thing.. i realized it isnt that amazing.. but giving the fact it boost about 250 vit it is crucial for my hp (40k isnt that much)
    so i have to resocket vit.. oder find vit crafted shoulders.. same goes for ik chest mostly high str but high vit on top is very expensive
    but as you said maybe i just start crafting items vit shoulders should be a good start then?

    about the ancient spear thing yes i got it in the past and as i said, overpower can be replaced by shout or in this case by spear, and good point at initial fury gen but warcry would have fit the same and better i think in overall scenario


    On Ancient Spear, fair enough. :) Like I said, I haven't tried it -- I've just heard really good things about rage flip when combined with three hundredth spear, no escape and weapon throw so I thought I'd throw it out there.

    The lifesteal lost from the belt would ideally be picked up on the EF (along with strength and a socket, otherwise I wouln't bother). If a lifesteal EF is out of reach right now, you'd need to stick with an IK belt.

    Of the three slots I'd craft, your current shoulders are the strongest so I'd touch them last. Crafted bracers will net you more strength (and thus more armor and damage), more crit (ToC sustainability and damage) and probably more all resist and possibly more vit. I would craft everything "of strength" because it will scale better as your gear continues to improve and in the meantime, you can make up some vit by resocketing, as you note.

    When you do craft shoulders though, I'd craft "of Strength", but vit is definitely a desirable roll there along with resist all. "of Vit" shoulders technically have the best max roll for Barbs, but it's not worth trying to optimize there until you're pretty close to perfect on your amulet and bracers and already have a decent pair of shoulders. If you've already made all other gear changes you intend to do for a while and you still feel you need a lot more health, you might consider crafting vit shoulders, but I wouldn't burn a lot of essences doing it if it were me since they are unlikely to scale as well when you do improve your other gear.

    As far as losing defense, you've got about 50 more AR and 1950 more armor than I do (though I do have higher dex for dodge chance and more melee reduction) and I'm fine on MP10, barring things like standing still on arcane / poison or the KD2 suicide bombers. Granted I'm running a WW spec, but you have substantially more crowd-control than I do via Seismic Slam. I'm running a much bigger budget than you, but here's my current build if you want to compare: http://us.battle.net...71/hero/1823905 Just keep in mind that I'm in the process of getting a new EF (crit damage / strength / socket) and I only have Unforgiving there because I was running some hell stuff for achievements. That will be replaced soon by Bloodthirst and I'll probably also be swapping a vit gem or two for strength.

    By the way, I do think it's a cool build and I think it will only get better as you continue to gear up.
    ...and if you disagree with me, you're probably <insert random ad hominem attack here>.
  • #8
    thanks for feedback again tanis..
    i nearly gave up on this spec..its purpose, for support for ranged characters, i originally thought, seems like it is more hated than loved..ive been kicked out of several games with this spec even with no cm wizz into it, cuz the knockback seems to suck for every class except the slamming barb himself :/
    later with ww spec i wasnt kicked, so my relatively low dps didnt seem to be the reason
    so im unsure of tracking this path further, or simply switching back to ww (what will be a bit annoying as i stated first quote)
    i tried this with another barb friend of me, he ran same spec and it was like wohoo :D
    but in groups, its not really much love returning for my knockback

    think ill start crafting ammys now and when i found one resocketing chest with vit to keep my hp about 40k
  • #9
    The gear isn't all that different between the two specs, so you could just swap a weapon and run WW more or less. WW isn't super popular in groups either though since keeping ToC up often involves running off way ahead of the group.
    ...and if you disagree with me, you're probably <insert random ad hominem attack here>.
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