I voted to keep them as they are I'd personally just like to see loot drops that are better than what I get. For the most part I farm gold to buy upgrades. Sometimes I'd like to just loot the upgrade.
While I voted for keeping both AH, I feel the real solution at this point is to keep both AH on the current server WHILE introducing a new server that is fully self found, as well as a trade (but no AH) server.
While that would lower the number of players per server, it will increase the total player base of the game while giving options to play the way they enjoy it.
Simply cutting the AH would cause D3 to lose many players, just like having both AH already caused D3 to lose many players.
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Alternatively Blizzard could fix the loot system in a way that makes the AH not detract from self finding gear, though this would take a lot more time/effort on Blizzard's end compared to simply making different servers. The main reason the AH seems like such an issue in the first place is because there are too many good items on it. Without a gear sink, it's pretty obvious that the value of self-found gear will drop quickly after each item patch.
AH is a nice and modern tool for buy/sell items, and easy use not prehistoric trade system on D2 with more scams and time needed for sell items...
Sorry but atm 57% players support both AH and only 21% players hates AH/RMAH.
I've always believed in the democratic way. Whatever the majority wants, I'll back it.
I voted to take them down, not adamantly not pounding my fists on my desk angry over it. I voted the way I did because of Wilson's comments stating that Blizzard sees the AH's as a serious problem. IF they cannot think of a viable solution, something that actually works and the players would like, they should take them down. If it's a problem and they can't fix it, take 'em down.
However, it seems obvious from the poll and the comments I've read @ Bnet Forums, most people want the AH's to stay, though most people have some level of discontent with them.
To me this reflects that Blizzard is on the same page as most players. Wilson's comments reflected exactly what this thread has shown....over 50% of players use the AH regularly...and most players would be upset if the AH's were taken down. Either way I wouldn't want to be in Blizzards shoes right now. Apparently the AH's were just another in a long line of critical mistakes by the dev team.
I'd love to see 200+ people vote on this to give a better sample. So far, the results are reflecting exactly what I suspected. A very evenly distributed schism between the players toward the issue of the AH's.
It appears *most people want the AH's to stay, either as is or with some revising.
Again, I believe a rethink of game creation and the public game realms is the answer.
I really think this poll needs to be re-done to ask just to either keep both or remove both. The problem that the AH creates - being able to obtain awesome gear with the exact stats wanted instantly - won't be solved if the AH's stay around, even with the 'revision' option people pick without giving any advice as to HOW to revise them.
If forced into one of the two options I'd be really interested to see what people picked.
So, the poll results show mixed feelings towards the AH.
With a general consensus (61%? is my math correct) that the AH should stay in the game; meaning that to these people its pros outweight its cons?
It's so easy to blindly adopt the "the AH ruined the game (all of it, it's unplayable!!!)" hyporbole as a philosophy, without considering what lead to its creation or even the other side of the equation (the people who like it).
I really think this poll needs to be re-done to ask just to either keep both or remove both. The problem that the AH creates - being able to obtain awesome gear with the exact stats wanted instantly - won't be solved if the AH's stay around, even with the 'revision' option people pick without giving any advice as to HOW to revise them.
If forced into one of the two options I'd be really interested to see what people picked.
I was very careful in making this poll. The mistake people often make when creating a poll is they do so to push an agenda. Or, they offer the respondents too few choices. As another member said earlier, this issue isn't black and white and I wanted my poll choices to reflect that.
Originally I was going to have three choices. Yes. No. Other.
It occurred to me that, when forced, people would vote 'NO' even though they feel the same as Blizzard on this issue, something needs to be done to change the basic framework of the AH's. i.e. I wanted people to be able to support to existence of the AH's while stating that they feel changes need to be made.
Originally I was going to have three choices. Yes. No. Other.
It occurred to me that, when forced, people would vote 'NO' even though they feel the same as Blizzard on this issue, something needs to be done to change the basic framework of the AH's. i.e. I wanted people to be able to support to existence of the AH's while stating that they feel changes need to be made.
Very good reasoning, and choice.
It also shows that while most people do support the existence AH, they are willing to recognize that it needs improvement (therefore it's somewhat of a fragile support).
No thanks, games where trading is done trough ingame marketplaces / forums
it takes days repeating/updating message S>whatnotitem+this55+that88+xx160+3socket.
When it finally comes to trading you have to sync clocks to be online at 5:30pm
then half of the time your "date" doesn't show up and went with someone else.
List goes on forever but you know what i'm talking about.
Many peoples issue with the AH's and how it affects the game is actually because of exactly what you said. The AH's make it too easy to acquire exactly what you want.
Not that it should difficult to trade, but as is, self-found items that are viable for you to use are painfully rare, almost non-existent once you get geared to a certain extent.
I understand what you mean though. There isn't going to be a perfect trade vehicle, all iterations of such will have some kind of drawback.
My confidence has been shaken. I cannot stress enough that whatever Blizzards plan is to "fix" this issue, if it makes things worse or otherwise fails, they've begun to nail their own coffin shut. This is no small matter. Making another mistake with such a critical component of the game would be suicidal.
I voted to keep them but change them. Basically I can see two options on how to "fix" the AH:
1) Make it so that the items traded in the AH are not BiS items but instead you would need to acquire the best items by playing. Some suggestions regarding this approach:
Increase the number of BoA (or BoE) stuff and make them more powerful than "tradable" stuff and make AH flipping more difficult by forcing the player to wear the bought items for X hours before he'll be able to sell them again (or better yet, force the player to gather X amount of exp while wearing the item before being able to sell them).
Or maybe items sold through the AH would get a "curse" which would drop their stats by 20% or something and you could "dispel" this curse by gaining exp while wearing the item. Maybe even all items could get more powerful as you gain exp while wearing them and this "buff" would be removed if the item is traded.
Also one option would be to add in the Mystic and making it so that all Mystic-enchanted items become un-tradable so basically you would only trade "base items" and then you'd have to enchant them to make them more powerful.
2) Decrease the convenience of the AH. One suggestion on how to do this occurred to me while I was playing PoE and here is my suggestion that I wrote on the PoE forums (slightly adjusted):
The semi-automatic "Auction House";
- A seller puts an item up and writes what he would want for it (gold/items/etc.) and the item would be "reserved" (or transferred) to the "Auction House" so the seller can't use it while it is posted
- A buyer can then send an offer to the seller and the game automatically "reserves" the offered items/gold from the buyers stash so they can't be used while the trade is still "open"
- The seller goes through all the offers he has got and if he accepts one, the trade is done automatically and all the other items offered by other players are freed. This would remove the hassle of having to agree on a certain time to be online with somebody.
- The seller and the buyers could "free" their items at any time if they later decide they didn't want to trade and the trade is still "open".
Thoughts?
PS. For me the worst thing in the "classic" trading system found in D2 and PoE is that trading takes so much time. I realize that it forces the player to really think what he should try to sell and what to scrap but still it just takes away too much of your time which really should be spent playing the game instead of browsing the forums.
+1
I'll add, I'm all for any system that predicates itself upon some kind of interaction between players.
PS: I really miss Runewords. I wish they would implement something similar and make them BoA. RW's were so dynamic and interesting, it would be curious to see how they would come into play without dupes.
Add a ladder with no auction house and exclusive items. Keep the Auction house in existing game. Both sides are happy everybody wins. SImple problems call for simple solutions. Surprised ladder hasn't been introduced yet. Ladder items would reduce the cost of every other item in the game because they would be better. Sure there would be botting in ladder mode but it would take them time to start up again every ladder reset. Starting from scratch every time. And hardcore ladder mode. bye bye bots.
Not sure how it would balance out, im no game designer. Seems pretty logical to me though.
I voted to keep them but change them. Basically I can see two options on how to "fix" the AH:
1) Make it so that the items traded in the AH are not BiS items but instead you would need to acquire the best items by playing. Some suggestions regarding this approach:
Increase the number of BoA (or BoE) stuff and make them more powerful than "tradable" stuff and make AH flipping more difficult by forcing the player to wear the bought items for X hours before he'll be able to sell them again (or better yet, force the player to gather X amount of exp while wearing the item before being able to sell them).
Or maybe items sold through the AH would get a "curse" which would drop their stats by 20% or something and you could "dispel" this curse by gaining exp while wearing the item. Maybe even all items could get more powerful as you gain exp while wearing them and this "buff" would be removed if the item is traded.
Also one option would be to add in the Mystic and making it so that all Mystic-enchanted items become un-tradable so basically you would only trade "base items" and then you'd have to enchant them to make them more powerful.
2) Decrease the convenience of the AH. One suggestion on how to do this occurred to me while I was playing PoE and here is my suggestion that I wrote on the PoE forums (slightly adjusted):
The semi-automatic "Auction House";
- A seller puts an item up and writes what he would want for it (gold/items/etc.) and the item would be "reserved" (or transferred) to the "Auction House" so the seller can't use it while it is posted
- A buyer can then send an offer to the seller and the game automatically "reserves" the offered items/gold from the buyers stash so they can't be used while the trade is still "open"
- The seller goes through all the offers he has got and if he accepts one, the trade is done automatically and all the other items offered by other players are freed. This would remove the hassle of having to agree on a certain time to be online with somebody.
- The seller and the buyers could "free" their items at any time if they later decide they didn't want to trade and the trade is still "open".
Thoughts?
PS. For me the worst thing in the "classic" trading system found in D2 and PoE is that trading takes so much time. I realize that it forces the player to really think what he should try to sell and what to scrap but still it just takes away too much of your time which really should be spent playing the game instead of browsing the forums.
I really like your idea of Semi-Automatic AH. I was thinking about something similar few days ago. It can be handy to trade a legendary with the wrong main stat for a similar one but with the right stat, or other items.
Remove the auction house ?!? But then, how will be we able to find good weapons ? By simply playing and hoping to find good drops ? How the hell can that be possible (serisouly).
I'm on the fence towards the AH, i really dont want the AH as its now but i do want some sort of interface where i can search/sell gear, i think its a step back going to D2 trading style.
Again, i'm on the fence, there are times where i miss the D2 trading style and times where i think AH is the right thing but badly executed.
I just feel like Jay Wilson's comments about the AH hurting the game were just a perfect example of how he is so detached from what the issues really are. The AH is a wonderful addition to the game, it was just the design decisions made to work with the AH that hurt the game.
There should be some way to remove good items from the economy (all items should be bind to account once equipped)
People shouldn't have to resort to AH to progress their character, but unfortunatley:
Difficulty of Inferno was too high at launch, forcing people to go to AH and buy good items from people who got to A4 inferno and farmed purple mobs for blues with 1000+ dps (for example).
If you never use AH, you have a very small chance of every getting a good item.
I voted other, my suggestion would be to add a 3rd option when making a character, besides softcore and hardcore, a ladder character which resets every 6 months and has no auction houses, when the reset occurs your character would get sent back to the "general population" of either softcore or hardcore, depending on what you picked when you made your character, in my case that would be hardcore. This would keep the game feeling a bit more fresh, in my opinion at least.
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While that would lower the number of players per server, it will increase the total player base of the game while giving options to play the way they enjoy it.
Simply cutting the AH would cause D3 to lose many players, just like having both AH already caused D3 to lose many players.
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Alternatively Blizzard could fix the loot system in a way that makes the AH not detract from self finding gear, though this would take a lot more time/effort on Blizzard's end compared to simply making different servers. The main reason the AH seems like such an issue in the first place is because there are too many good items on it. Without a gear sink, it's pretty obvious that the value of self-found gear will drop quickly after each item patch.
I've always believed in the democratic way. Whatever the majority wants, I'll back it.
I voted to take them down, not adamantly not pounding my fists on my desk angry over it. I voted the way I did because of Wilson's comments stating that Blizzard sees the AH's as a serious problem. IF they cannot think of a viable solution, something that actually works and the players would like, they should take them down. If it's a problem and they can't fix it, take 'em down.
However, it seems obvious from the poll and the comments I've read @ Bnet Forums, most people want the AH's to stay, though most people have some level of discontent with them.
To me this reflects that Blizzard is on the same page as most players. Wilson's comments reflected exactly what this thread has shown....over 50% of players use the AH regularly...and most players would be upset if the AH's were taken down. Either way I wouldn't want to be in Blizzards shoes right now. Apparently the AH's were just another in a long line of critical mistakes by the dev team.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
I really think this poll needs to be re-done to ask just to either keep both or remove both. The problem that the AH creates - being able to obtain awesome gear with the exact stats wanted instantly - won't be solved if the AH's stay around, even with the 'revision' option people pick without giving any advice as to HOW to revise them.
If forced into one of the two options I'd be really interested to see what people picked.
With a general consensus (61%? is my math correct) that the AH should stay in the game; meaning that to these people its pros outweight its cons?
It's so easy to blindly adopt the "the AH ruined the game (all of it, it's unplayable!!!)" hyporbole as a philosophy, without considering what lead to its creation or even the other side of the equation (the people who like it).
I was very careful in making this poll. The mistake people often make when creating a poll is they do so to push an agenda. Or, they offer the respondents too few choices. As another member said earlier, this issue isn't black and white and I wanted my poll choices to reflect that.
Originally I was going to have three choices. Yes. No. Other.
It occurred to me that, when forced, people would vote 'NO' even though they feel the same as Blizzard on this issue, something needs to be done to change the basic framework of the AH's. i.e. I wanted people to be able to support to existence of the AH's while stating that they feel changes need to be made.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
It also shows that while most people do support the existence AH, they are willing to recognize that it needs improvement (therefore it's somewhat of a fragile support).
Currently played toon: https://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Rage-2973/hero/97362116
Many peoples issue with the AH's and how it affects the game is actually because of exactly what you said. The AH's make it too easy to acquire exactly what you want.
Not that it should difficult to trade, but as is, self-found items that are viable for you to use are painfully rare, almost non-existent once you get geared to a certain extent.
I understand what you mean though. There isn't going to be a perfect trade vehicle, all iterations of such will have some kind of drawback.
My confidence has been shaken. I cannot stress enough that whatever Blizzards plan is to "fix" this issue, if it makes things worse or otherwise fails, they've begun to nail their own coffin shut. This is no small matter. Making another mistake with such a critical component of the game would be suicidal.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
+1
I'll add, I'm all for any system that predicates itself upon some kind of interaction between players.
PS: I really miss Runewords. I wish they would implement something similar and make them BoA. RW's were so dynamic and interesting, it would be curious to see how they would come into play without dupes.
BurningRope#1322 (US~HC) Request an invite to the official (NA) <dfans> Clan
Not sure how it would balance out, im no game designer. Seems pretty logical to me though.
I voted for this because I haven't seen a good idea on how they can be improved.
The AH worked perfectly for me as casual player I could trade the stuff I don't need an could acquire stuff i needed without too much trouble.
At the end I was playing the game more and spend less time on trading, so the AH works as intended for me.
I really like your idea of Semi-Automatic AH. I was thinking about something similar few days ago. It can be handy to trade a legendary with the wrong main stat for a similar one but with the right stat, or other items.
Again, i'm on the fence, there are times where i miss the D2 trading style and times where i think AH is the right thing but badly executed.