Imo I think inferno is just the difficulty that Blizzard will eventually add certain endgame elements to such as Ubers and other such things. But until those are patched into the game I believe Inferno is the endgame.
I totally disagree with what Sixen said on the PodCast. Diablo III will ship out at release with Inferno as its initial End-Game content. It will take months of sleepless nights & grueling play before someone gets through hell, much more even try to get through Inferno.
Jay Wilson may have said that Inferno has a flat-level system so people will not choose where to grind & farm the content for the best gear, but that doesn't mean that Inferno would be a child's play that you could just whizz through with ease in a week or so.
On the side, I just want to remind NOOBS & those who never got to play through the HELL difficulty of Diablo II that Inferno most likely would be a difficulty level that you'll only get to hear, but will never get to play.
Since Blizzard designed it to be really, really hard, only the dedicated & die-hard players of Diablo II who were able to reach Hell difficulty will most likely be the only ones to reach the end-game content.
So, you can wish whatever you want it to be, but in the end, you'll only be able to play it in your dreams...
Another thing to keep in mind is the achievments, which has been said will provide visual rewards. Some of these achievments will probably be VERY hard and needs a lot of hours in order to complete. Personally the implementation of inferno mode and the achievments will keep me busy for a long long time. I'm not worried.
And I personally still think finishing diablo 2 in hell without boosting and twinking is REALLY hard. Why would they make Diablo 3 ezmode compared to this? I am sure diablo 3 will be hard enough. If you think you can just steamroll from normal -> inferno and then be finished with the game you are extremely optimistic.
Jay Wilson saying that basic monsters will be AT LEAST level 61. This means INFERNO is not flat...monsters will get strong as u will go further in an act and in other acts
I think it means that trash is lvl61, mini-boss might be lvl62-63 and End of act bosses might be lvl65 or whatever the actual numbers are. Act1 trash = Act4 trash and so on.
I think it means that trash is lvl61, mini-boss might be lvl62-63 and End of act bosses might be lvl65 or whatever the actual numbers are. Act1 trash = Act4 trash and so on.
I don't know about that... End of act bosses that high would one shot us I think... especially with 4 people in a party. I assume barbarians will be able to take the most hits. Other characters may take 1 or 2 hits before having to flee and heal.
Jay has said in more than one interview they aren't sure if they want noraml-hell clear to be a once and done experience or not, at this point. He also mentioned they would need some kind of stumbling blocks to be created if that were not the case. That leads me to believe that, as of right now, they see players going right into inferno difficulty.
I think it's a great stretch of the imagination to assume most players won't be able to see inferno for months.
Stev89....what you said there...would be a HUGE idea.I really like that idea. I really hope there are quests. Which are random. And even if u completed a full difficulty. (any of the 4) when u start up a new game. There should be new quests. Random quests. And they should be (after finishing) repeatable. But different from before....Like 1 time you have to clear a dungeon. The next time u have to free a friendly npc. Next time search a tool for a artisan. Things like that...
Also I read people about updates? What updates lol? If the game is release there wont be any updates until expansion. They said they will do updates. If d2 is being repeated. Like just 1 part of the map. BY EVERYONE! Then they will make things different...but
Think about it. You buy ts game. And then they make a update? for what? wasnt the game good already???
Another thing I didnt get...in Inferno the monsters are MINIMUM level 61. But this doesnt mean that act 4 monsters are level 61. They will be higher right?
So for that sake they will drop higher end game gear. So why grind in act 1 inferno when act 4 inferno drops better gear?
Or is it really so that you get the same kind of CHANCES and drops in act 1 as in act 4?
Another thing isnt it silly that a normal monster in act 1 inferno. Has the same drop rates as the super end boss(probebly diablo) in act 4 inferno?
Maybe you will say..they dont have same drop rates....but if they dont have same drop rates...then EVERY ONE will only be in act 4. repeatingly killing diablo. Start new game. Killing diablo. Start new game....And Jay wilson said that wont be the case....
So if no1 here can tell me how that blizzard will stop you from repeatingly killing diablo. Then you dont know anything about end game...and this discussion is pointless...
Unless you will say same droprate for diablo as for normal monsters.....= WTF? I kill 1 monster in 2 hits. I kill diablo in 100 hits...same outcome??? WTF?
i just browsed through what you said but if you listened to the podcast i referred to in my original post they correct the "minimum" level with "maximum" and said the minimum thing was a mistype or error, because all monsters are lvl 61 in inferno. just FYI
I actually agree partly with both sides on this discussion. I am in love with the concept of Inferno difficulty and think it was an awesome choice to toss it in. On the other hand I understand where Sixen was coming from on the podcast. Sixen opposes it not because it in no way "resembles an endgame structure" because it certainly does and I will love it. I believe his main beef with it is the rehashing for endgame. Let me explain a bit.
Inferno being the endgame would resemble WoW having Heroic 5 mans as endgame. Where you are repeating the same content yet just a bit harder instead of being a stepping stone. So a system that I believe Sixen would 100% agree with would be inferno mode being the final means of progression for a super challenge coming in the form of never before experienced content.
What I think all of us can certainly agree on is that we welcome ,with open arms, the challenge Inferno will bring to the table.
I like the Inferno mode though I have a suggestion.
For people that have been grinding Inferno and has a lot of Inferno gear, they might find that a lvl 61 mob is now too easy so my suggestion is: Act1 - Mobs lvl 61, Act2 - Mobs lvl 62, Act3 - mobs lvl 63, act4 - mobs lvl 64.
That idea you have there isn't a stroke of brilliance or anything; That's putting it right back where it was before. That makes it so the act 4 monsters are then once again what everyone grinds because they're the highest level mob. Terrible idea.
I like the Inferno mode though I have a suggestion.
For people that have been grinding Inferno and has a lot of Inferno gear, they might find that a lvl 61 mob is now too easy so my suggestion is: Act1 - Mobs lvl 61, Act2 - Mobs lvl 62, Act3 - mobs lvl 63, act4 - mobs lvl 64.
That idea you have there isn't a stroke of brilliance or anything; That's putting it right back where it was before. That makes it so the act 4 monsters are then once again what everyone grinds because they're the highest level mob. Terrible idea.
agreed, they said inferno is "flat" so therefor everything SHOULD be lvl 61, its not a minimum level its a maximum. so its the same amount of difficulty throughout, if it increased at all then saying its "flat" would be a lie. so obviously there all the same level. i will enjoy inferno a lot because mf running in d2 in 3 areas in hell literally 1000 times got old real fast. i think it counts as end-game for DIABLO.
I am actually a little confused on the "maximum 61" logic. I saw an interview with Jay saying that we would need to farm Hell in prep for entering Inferno. If their intent was a flat difficulty with a max mob level of 61 is it wise to drop gear in Inferno? Unless the Inferno gear is a very minimal upgrade from end of Hell gear then I can see Inferno getting easier as we acquire gear.
1) Inferno gear minimal upgrade from Hell - 61 max monster level - challenge maintained
2) Inferno gear normal upgrade from Hell - 61 max monster level - challenge lost eventually
3) Inferno gear normal upgrade from Hell - 61 min monster level - challenge maintained
I may be wrong but I thought Blizzard said that there would be a minimal difficulty curve but there would be a curve. Acquiring gear upgrades and 2 rune levels while keeping all monster level 61 max just seems to contradict itself in my opinion. But if they do have a very small curve, be it just a level, but same loot tables across all acts then players will flock to the lowest end for farming which is also a contradiction to Inferno's goal.
I am quite confused and may be misinformed so if I am someone please put me on a straight path if you would be so kind.
I am actually a little confused on the "maximum 61" logic. I saw an interview with Jay saying that we would need to farm Hell in prep for entering Inferno. If their intent was a flat difficulty with a max mob level of 61 is it wise to drop gear in Inferno? Unless the Inferno gear is a very minimal upgrade from end of Hell gear then I can see Inferno getting easier as we acquire gear.
1) Inferno gear minimal upgrade from Hell - 61 max monster level - challenge maintained
2) Inferno gear normal upgrade from Hell - 61 max monster level - challenge lost eventually
3) Inferno gear normal upgrade from Hell - 61 min monster level - challenge maintained
I may be wrong but I thought Blizzard said that there would be a minimal difficulty curve but there would be a curve. Acquiring gear upgrades and 2 rune levels while keeping all monster level 61 max just seems to contradict itself in my opinion. But if they do have a very small curve, be it just a level, but same loot tables across all acts then players will flock to the lowest end for farming which is also a contradiction to Inferno's goal.
I am quite confused and may be misinformed so if I am someone please put me on a straight path if you would be so kind.
it was my understanding of inferno is from the very beginning its INSANELY hard, like going into hell in d2 with terrible gear. and to AVOID people farming ONE location they made the entire inferno mode the same from the first monster you encounter in act 1 to the last one you encounter in act 4. which i think makes sense, and it only becomes easier if you get gear. the challenge will last long i believe, because i think even with full inferno gear it will still be difficult to kill things and survive in inferno and they made it that way on purpose.
Ah thanks. So Inferno gear and runes will take us from being able to survive in Inferno to slightly comfortable but never out of harms way. Seems very nice.
Ah thanks. So Inferno gear and runes will take us from being able to survive in Inferno to slightly comfortable but never out of harms way. Seems very nice.
well we can hope they don't reduce the difficulty when people start complaining its so hard, lol
For Blizzard to say Inferno is "end-game" does sorta seem like a cheap cop-out. There are literally tons of end-game ideas out there yet they implemented none of them and instead are just adjusting monsters to lvl 61... seems sort of lazy to me.
To me end-game content should be a sort of fun or challenging competitive Test! You shouldn't be still building your character in an end-game, you should be putting your character and skills to the Ultimate Test - Whether it be against other players, a never-ending horde, or an uber boss- it should still push your character to the limit and hopefully, over the limit.
using wow as a comparison because everyone (but mostly about sixen) considers it end game. and in wow "end game" you are still building your character, honing your skills and getting the best gear exactly how inferno is. so i don't see how that point makes inferno not end game when its comparable to heroics and raids like I've pointed out.
Um I didn't say anything about WoW. In fact, I am pretty sure Diablo is Not WoW. I simply defined what an end-game is and said adding a 4th difficulty does not constitute as an end-game. I mean heck! how can Inferno BE the end-game when you have to beat the game all over again. Its like saying the final level in pacman is actually the end-game.
end-game = content after game has ended. Inferno is still the same game.
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Blizzard used to care about releasing Diablo III, then they all took an arrow in the knee...
For Blizzard to say Inferno is "end-game" does sorta seem like a cheap cop-out. There are literally tons of end-game ideas out there yet they implemented none of them and instead are just adjusting monsters to lvl 61... seems sort of lazy to me.
To me end-game content should be a sort of fun or challenging competitive Test! You shouldn't be still building your character in an end-game, you should be putting your character and skills to the Ultimate Test - Whether it be against other players, a never-ending horde, or an uber boss- it should still push your character to the limit and hopefully, over the limit.
using wow as a comparison because everyone (but mostly about sixen) considers it end game. and in wow "end game" you are still building your character, honing your skills and getting the best gear exactly how inferno is. so i don't see how that point makes inferno not end game when its comparable to heroics and raids like I've pointed out.
Um I didn't say anything about WoW. In fact, I am pretty sure Diablo is Not WoW. I simply defined what an end-game is and said adding a 4th difficulty does not constitute as an end-game. I mean heck! how can Inferno BE the end-game when you have to beat the game all over again. Its like saying the final level in pacman is actually the end-game.
end-game = content after game has ended. Inferno is still the same game.
i didn't say you did mention wow. i was using that as an example for my argument. everyone just thinks about the fact that its another play through it removes any notion that its end game. but thats completely false. but the fact that you have to be MAX level and fairly skilled / geared to get through it, makes it so it IS an end game, if you were still leveling up in inferno, then of course it wouldn't be. but your not, the game is over after your 60 and kill whoever the end boss is in hell, then INFERNO is added as end game for an extra challenge and extra super gear. so in the end, its end-game material. maybe its not the BEST choice but it still is end-game regardless
Inferno mode doesnt give you a reason to be more powerfull once you can beat it... If i can beat inferno easily, then why do i need better gear?? ..no point.
Thats why its not a end game ...you need something that you can always do better and makes it worth to keep farming for better and better items... PVP usually makes ppl feel like they realy need to become even more strong. Also ensless dungeons could make this happen, so in order to last longer on them you will have to find better gear...and well many things can came to your mind.
Inferno is a good place for end game farming...but not a end game itself.
Inferno mode doesnt give you a reason to be more powerfull once you can beat it... If i can beat inferno easily, then why do i need better gear?? ..no point.
Thats why its not a end game ...you need something that you can always do better and makes it worth to keep farming for better and better items... PVP usually makes ppl feel like they realy need to become even more strong. Also ensless dungeons could make this happen, so in order to last longer on them you will have to find better gear...and well many things can came to your mind.
Inferno is a good place for end game farming...but not a end game itself.
uhm... ? lol. dont troll on my posts please. the entire idea of inferno = super super difficult, so there will be no way you can beat it even remotely easily even WITH the powerful gear.
Inferno mode doesnt give you a reason to be more powerfull once you can beat it... If i can beat inferno easily, then why do i need better gear?? ..no point.
Thats why its not a end game ...you need something that you can always do better and makes it worth to keep farming for better and better items... PVP usually makes ppl feel like they realy need to become even more strong. Also ensless dungeons could make this happen, so in order to last longer on them you will have to find better gear...and well many things can came to your mind.
Inferno is a good place for end game farming...but not a end game itself.
I think the point of Inferno is to have some sort of prestige among players.
"How far are you in the game".
"I just beat Inferno act 3".
"Cool ^^".
The prestige lies in the fact that you don't level anymore, i.e. get stronger. Only the gear you wear will change.
Ya, but everyone (exept casual players mybe) will beat Inferno sooner or later.. end game is for those who keep playing a lot after the story is done, and those kind of players will beat inferno for sure. And after a few runs it probably wont be that hard, or mybe it will always stay the same hard...so, again, it wont make much sense to keep doing it once you know you can do it, unless its for somthing else...
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Jay Wilson may have said that Inferno has a flat-level system so people will not choose where to grind & farm the content for the best gear, but that doesn't mean that Inferno would be a child's play that you could just whizz through with ease in a week or so.
People should listen more closely to what Jay is saying & really hear him out, because according to Jay in this two interview videos, Inferno would really, really be a very hard & difficult level that you'll need to make many more runs in Hell (listen to his explanation from time stamp 1:00 up to 1:52 here: http://www.pcgames.de/Diablo-3-PC-27763/News/Diablo-3-Video-Interview-von-der-Gamescom-Auktionshaus-Online-Zwang-Inferno-und-mehr-840078/)
before you're character would be suitably equipped for the task of facing the HORDES OF MONSTERS WHOSE MINIMUM LEVEL IS 61 (now listen to him from time stamp 0:43 up to 1:02 only:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGTcyLdZrqE).
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On the side, I just want to remind NOOBS & those who never got to play through the HELL difficulty of Diablo II that Inferno most likely would be a difficulty level that you'll only get to hear, but will never get to play.
Since Blizzard designed it to be really, really hard, only the dedicated & die-hard players of Diablo II who were able to reach Hell difficulty will most likely be the only ones to reach the end-game content.
So, you can wish whatever you want it to be, but in the end, you'll only be able to play it in your dreams...
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My PvP build would be different from these 13.
Check out the leaked Demon Hunter skill list here from Blizzard China: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://tiny.cc/10p16
Diablo III is $50; MSI GT683DXR-423US Gaming Laptop is $1,599; Playing Diablo III w/ my wife & 2 brothers is PRICELESS
And I personally still think finishing diablo 2 in hell without boosting and twinking is REALLY hard. Why would they make Diablo 3 ezmode compared to this? I am sure diablo 3 will be hard enough. If you think you can just steamroll from normal -> inferno and then be finished with the game you are extremely optimistic.
I think it means that trash is lvl61, mini-boss might be lvl62-63 and End of act bosses might be lvl65 or whatever the actual numbers are. Act1 trash = Act4 trash and so on.
I think it's a great stretch of the imagination to assume most players won't be able to see inferno for months.
i just browsed through what you said but if you listened to the podcast i referred to in my original post they correct the "minimum" level with "maximum" and said the minimum thing was a mistype or error, because all monsters are lvl 61 in inferno. just FYI
Inferno being the endgame would resemble WoW having Heroic 5 mans as endgame. Where you are repeating the same content yet just a bit harder instead of being a stepping stone. So a system that I believe Sixen would 100% agree with would be inferno mode being the final means of progression for a super challenge coming in the form of never before experienced content.
What I think all of us can certainly agree on is that we welcome ,with open arms, the challenge Inferno will bring to the table.
That idea you have there isn't a stroke of brilliance or anything; That's putting it right back where it was before. That makes it so the act 4 monsters are then once again what everyone grinds because they're the highest level mob. Terrible idea.
agreed, they said inferno is "flat" so therefor everything SHOULD be lvl 61, its not a minimum level its a maximum. so its the same amount of difficulty throughout, if it increased at all then saying its "flat" would be a lie. so obviously there all the same level. i will enjoy inferno a lot because mf running in d2 in 3 areas in hell literally 1000 times got old real fast. i think it counts as end-game for DIABLO.
1) Inferno gear minimal upgrade from Hell - 61 max monster level - challenge maintained
2) Inferno gear normal upgrade from Hell - 61 max monster level - challenge lost eventually
3) Inferno gear normal upgrade from Hell - 61 min monster level - challenge maintained
I may be wrong but I thought Blizzard said that there would be a minimal difficulty curve but there would be a curve. Acquiring gear upgrades and 2 rune levels while keeping all monster level 61 max just seems to contradict itself in my opinion. But if they do have a very small curve, be it just a level, but same loot tables across all acts then players will flock to the lowest end for farming which is also a contradiction to Inferno's goal.
I am quite confused and may be misinformed so if I am someone please put me on a straight path if you would be so kind.
it was my understanding of inferno is from the very beginning its INSANELY hard, like going into hell in d2 with terrible gear. and to AVOID people farming ONE location they made the entire inferno mode the same from the first monster you encounter in act 1 to the last one you encounter in act 4. which i think makes sense, and it only becomes easier if you get gear. the challenge will last long i believe, because i think even with full inferno gear it will still be difficult to kill things and survive in inferno and they made it that way on purpose.
well we can hope they don't reduce the difficulty when people start complaining its so hard, lol
Um I didn't say anything about WoW. In fact, I am pretty sure Diablo is Not WoW. I simply defined what an end-game is and said adding a 4th difficulty does not constitute as an end-game. I mean heck! how can Inferno BE the end-game when you have to beat the game all over again. Its like saying the final level in pacman is actually the end-game.
end-game = content after game has ended. Inferno is still the same game.
i didn't say you did mention wow. i was using that as an example for my argument. everyone just thinks about the fact that its another play through it removes any notion that its end game. but thats completely false. but the fact that you have to be MAX level and fairly skilled / geared to get through it, makes it so it IS an end game, if you were still leveling up in inferno, then of course it wouldn't be. but your not, the game is over after your 60 and kill whoever the end boss is in hell, then INFERNO is added as end game for an extra challenge and extra super gear. so in the end, its end-game material. maybe its not the BEST choice but it still is end-game regardless
Thats why its not a end game ...you need something that you can always do better and makes it worth to keep farming for better and better items... PVP usually makes ppl feel like they realy need to become even more strong. Also ensless dungeons could make this happen, so in order to last longer on them you will have to find better gear...and well many things can came to your mind.
Inferno is a good place for end game farming...but not a end game itself.
uhm... ? lol. dont troll on my posts please. the entire idea of inferno = super super difficult, so there will be no way you can beat it even remotely easily even WITH the powerful gear.
Ya, but everyone (exept casual players mybe) will beat Inferno sooner or later.. end game is for those who keep playing a lot after the story is done, and those kind of players will beat inferno for sure. And after a few runs it probably wont be that hard, or mybe it will always stay the same hard...so, again, it wont make much sense to keep doing it once you know you can do it, unless its for somthing else...