Also I'm not going to try to defend my points if anyone wants to take a swing be my guest. My points remain facts and stand true for the most part regardless if some of them can't be compared 99% identical to my references, however 95% IS close enough. Don't be so closed minded is all I can say.
Also ScyberDragon you didn't understand my point on the u.i. I guess I worded it wrong. I was talking about the character screen page that has the characters equipment and such in the old trailer.
The character screen was said to be just a plac holder until they worked on one for diablo.
Unless you can get an exact quote on where they said that it was place holder I believe on this point you are wrong.
A place holder was also said to be in place for the dark cultist but that was never true either. In truth if the community never spoke up it could have been in the final product.
It was for that very reason the overworld in Diablo II was boring and the vast majority of people just skipped it and got rushed. Now that it's semi-static (not "static," like everyone is saying still), they can actually focus more on interesting, beautiful, or terrifying environments since they don't have to worry about how x square plugs in to y square. The outside environments they've shown so far look absolutely stellar by comparison, and that stuff isn't even final. It's aesthetically interesting to see all the different little bits they can put in now, all the intricate details, that they couldn't in Diablo II. In Diablo II, you have a bunch of completely flat, 10x10 mile grass plots, maybe a house with nothing of interest in or around it, and then a fence lining the area. The only area that I really considered an exception to this was the Dark Wood and Act III. I think most of your memories are either clouded with nostalgia or just really, really bad.
So why couldn't Diablo 3 have random generated areas that look as good as you want them? You are suggesting it isn't possible (I think? Not really sure what you are suggesting). I disagree and think it would add a lot more playability and flavor to the game if they added it in. The diablo 2 was only a reference in that time period. Back in 2000 devs didn't have the technology they do now. I don't understand the unoriginal and half-assed attitude being taken with diablo 3.
Kgydkgyd, I refuse to read what you wrote unless you fix the massive jumble of words into something readable. That means work on the grammar, spelling, and sentence structure.
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Just as the Scorpion hunts...
Silently Lurking...
"Nothing is True. Everything is Permitted." ~ Ezio Auditore de Firenze
Kgydkgyd, I refuse to read what you wrote unless you fix the massive jumble of words into something readable. That means work on the grammar, spelling, and sentence structure.
There is nothing wrong with the grammar, spelling, or sentence structure.
Oh sorry, I didn't realize that Kgydkgyd was an actual person. Sorry bro. I thought you were referring to me lol.
OP, Your post wouldn't have been so long if you didn't say how long it was going to be, (lol) and repeat yourself 32045F48 times. lol.
And mosts of your points didn't make any sense, also with references that didn't back up your points. But I agree with your worrying. But not for any of the reasons.
This will be a long post but it should be fairly interesting if you are looking forward to diablo 3, so don't dismiss it right away please.
Imho I am worried about diablo 3. Hear me out please and take all my points into consideration. I feel that they are not being original enough with diablo 3. Yes I am going to say it, "world of warcraft" but really I don't have any problem whatsoever with that game. In fact when I played it I enjoyed it thoroughly. The only reason I quit playing was because it ended up becoming more like an actual job rather than fun. My real quarrel is that they just aren't being original enough with diablo 3 and maybe they simply lost their blizzard touch on this one.
Again if you are still with me, hear me out please because I would really like to get my point across in detail. I will list a bunch of reasons regarding why I've decided I am worried about diablo 3 and potentially future blizzard games. Some regard to WoW, some regard to the game itself, some points just regarding blizzard in general. Keep in mind my main focus here isn't to compare it to WoW its simply to compare my points to the unoriginality that's being pushed on Diablo 3.
I will be bringing up some old points and some new ones. But again, I would really like you to follow through with me, Look and see where I am coming from because really, I am worried about D3 and future blizz products. I have no doubt D3 will be fun but it isn't the diablo 3 I envisioned when I was imagining what it would be like when I was playing diablo 2. I know everyone out there that played D2 envisioned what a diablo 3 would be like in their own minds. I have to say that I didn't envision D3 to be anything like what they were/are creating.
I will list my reasons for the personal conclusion that I've come to and please keep an open mind. This comes down to originality and making diablo 3 as good as it can be and what it should/could have been like with the right minds doing the right job.
1.My link This is a link to the dark cultist. Copy and paste undead WoW. They could have been a bit more original on this. Yes doing things like this saves time but... it just cuts the originality of Diablo and its sequel #3 like a hot knife through butter. And let's be honest with each other, if they are going to do something as obvious as this WHO KNOWS how many more of these there could be in the game that were just copy and pasted?
2. Diablo 3 items when they first released information about them were originallyoriginally going to be in a unique- then -epic order with epic items being purple colored and the best you could get until the community outraged and it was changed (at least I think it was changed?). Even if it wasn't changed the point stands on an originality basis.
3. The original Character screen U.I that can be seen in the original gameplay trailer found on the D3 website. Basically copy and pasted from world of warcraft. Again, it isn't WoW being the problem, its the unoriginal eye being scoured into D3 like some hot twisted piece of metal. Yes it was changed for the better, but what kind of product would we have got if we never said anything about their work??
4. The stylized art style. I know its a hot topic and we all know it isn't going to change because it would basically be resetting everything they have done. That isn't the point though and I'm not asking them to change it I'm just dropping it into the melting pot of my overall concerns.
When I first envisioned diablo 3 I envisioned something like this. My link
I really have to admit that I did not envision anything like this.. My link
5. Health orbs. Yes they feel very arcade like and everyone knows they could do a better job on it rather than putting floating red globes everywhere for health. We all know there can't be any more potion spamming because that just doesn't work but floating red balls that pop out of enemies? Come on, we all know they can do better than this.
6. 60 level limit now. I think this speaks for itself. Nothing really wrong with it but it isn't original for diablo 3, it isn't a good idea in my opinion and it kind of ruins skill tree's based on the fact that you wont have the amount of points to play around with that you did in D2. Once you finish hell you should be level 60. I'm just wondering if there's going to be mounts at 40 now based on this unoriginality thumb print that I can't seem to watch out of my eyes for diablo 3. Just because something works in another game doesn't mean its the best solution and the best idea.
7. The glowing aspects of the game that just look ugly and dumbs the game down. Take the original gameplay trailer as example. The skeletons have glowing shields, the entire area under the dungeon is glowing. There's virtually no realistic firelight radius at all. The glowing weapons on the barbarian that deal extra lightning/ice damage is way to excessive. It's just all too pretty for diablo 3. Just refer to this picture again. My link This is what it's all about. Not ridiculous amounts of glowing objects/areas however that seems to be the theme on what diablo 3 is based around.
8. Only 4 characters per game based on how intense the visuals are. Here's an idea... tone the visuals down? The combat doesn't have to be a giant glowing rainbow bomb unless they want it to be.
9. None-changing area's. Only dungeons are randomly changed. The outside world is static. I find this completely boring if the level cap will be 60 and if we will finish hell by level 60 I see a very boring game that will be a lot less repetitive than D2.
At the moment I can't think of any other reasons to prove my point that I am very concerned with diablo 3 and concerned for diablo 3's unoriginality and the ideas and gameplay that made blizzard what it did at the time of D2//warcraft 3. When I look at diablo 3 what pops into my mind on what they have done so far is "what was the easiest solution", "What can we copy and paste that will work?", "lets do what will save the most time and resources". Imho Those are the first things that pop into my head when I take a real good look at Diablo 3 so far, I'm just worried about diablo 3 and future blizzard products in general if they are going to keep doing this crap again and again. I mean just think about what we would end up with if we didn't voice ANY concerns about the game at all. Really think about that and re-read my points as much as you want. Just remember, what would we get if we didn't say anything about their progress?
Anyway, I hope you thought this was interesting and at least insightful on some level or another. In the end I personally wont be getting the "OMG THAT IS AMAZING!" Diablo 3 that I expected I would be. Instead I will be getting the handmedown unoriginal game created for the masses. Fun may it still be, the point is what it could have been. In the end my main goal with this was to at least open some peoples eye's just a little bit so we don't end up accepting everything we get without question. If we do that we will all end up like console gamers in the very near future.
Ok well I'm sorry but please do your research before you try to complain....for one the whole entire game is random... including the reg maps they said you could play threw the game untill the next would come out and still almost always have different maps so no repetitive there they fixed that learning from D2... On that note Jay said him self that the further you get in the game the more "dark" "griter" "gloomy" it will get...evil is returning into the world JUST NOW in D3... in D2 evil already took over the world...they want us to see the transition of the world of the sanctuary and how its getting to be evil and bad agin further we go closer to hell more death, blood, darkness ECT>>>(ps a reminder this is not the same team that made D2 and please alot of people including you are comparing D3 to D2 remember its Diablo 3 not Diablo 2....).
For 2 remember they are the gods in that game(meaning blizz and the programmers) they can make 60 lvls still feel like 99 its just they have room to move content (plus they said it will be just as long as D2 hence now theres room to get better items and more skills ETC>>>)I do agree the the originality on the game is a little less then usally. But still have faith your only judging what they allowed to see just...there not gonna show you the biggest baddest boss in the deepest darkest deeps of hell are they? noo wow repeat...lol I mad a thread about this when they first announced D3 thats how i got into this web site i made a account just for something that you are saying...trust me I' pretty sure I'm a wiki my self...I've watched every interview...read almost any important thread on here rather I put my 2 cents in or not (including some random threads :)) each blizz con ( tried to go to this years its D3s blizzcon dident get tickets in time...:()this is the most I have ever been excited about a game EVER ive been keeping up in info.. somethings I like somethings I dont but remember they are doing it to innovate the game
3.The whole the whole UI thing...ya ok a lil wowish too but they did that so instead of haveing to switch from 2 diff skills now you have 7 so that i like (plus they are trying to put more pvp aspects into D3 trying to make a lil competive hopefully that will be nice...2 out of 3 of there BIG games are on the competive map why not put the last one up? I think it would be awsome)so really I think they did the whole UI thing for PvP. Plus more combos/interesting moves/builds
imho I think we should at least have 5 people in a game... I would like 1 of every class to be able to be in the game at once...and I like chaos idc... everyones getting good computers...if your a pc gamer and you dont have a dou core at least then your not a pc gamer...sorry... I think we should have the choice of how many people we want or something in that general direction...because I think of 10+ friends and I are getting D3 and we cant play together...
DUMB...
all I can say is just wait till the game comes out...
The OP is putting WAY to much thought into a game that isn't even in Beta. TBH this is the exact same BS that went around during the period I was an active member of these forums... about 2 years ago >.<...
Thankfully someone else has answered each of your points.
I do not believe that castlevania image is good at all, in fact I think it's terrible. It looks ok static, but it's so grainy and try hard "gritty" that moving around on it would make your eyes bleed.
Is a more accurate representation of the game.
Also, comparing it to wow, is automatic fail.
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"If we're actually making the game worse with no other reason than to be different from WoW, then it's a bad choice." - Jay Wilson (D3 lead designer)
1. My link This is a link to the dark cultist. Copy and paste undead WoW. They could have been a bit more original on this. Yes doing things like this saves time but... it just cuts the originality of Diablo and its sequel #3 like a hot knife through butter. And let's be honest with each other, if they are going to do something as obvious as this WHO KNOWS how many more of these there could be in the game that were just copy and pasted?
I thought I was about to enter a thread where I'd agree with the OP, but then you criticized the Dark Cultists. The cultists are, in my opinion, the most diablo looking monsters in the game. Are you mad?
The stylized art style. I know its a hot topic and we all know it isn't going to change because it would basically be resetting everything they have done. That isn't the point though and I'm not asking them to change it I'm just dropping it into the melting pot of my overall concerns.
I don't like the art style either. Not much else to say about it now. Like you said, they can't exactly change it this far into the game.
When I first envisioned diablo 3 I envisioned something like this.
My link
That makes two of us.
Health orbs. Yes they feel very arcade like and everyone knows they could do a better job on it rather than putting floating red globes everywhere for health. We all know there can't be any more potion spamming because that just doesn't work but floating red balls that pop out of enemies? Come on, we all know they can do better than this.
I'm in the minority on health globes. I like them, and I prefer the original design.
60 level limit now. I think this speaks for itself. Nothing really wrong with it but it isn't original for diablo 3, it isn't a good idea in my opinion and it kind of ruins skill tree's based on the fact that you wont have the amount of points to play around with that you did in D2. Once you finish hell you should be level 60. I'm just wondering if there's going to be mounts at 40 now based on this unoriginality thumb print that I can't seem to watch out of my eyes for diablo 3. Just because something works in another game doesn't mean its the best solution and the best idea.
I agree with what Bashiok said about levels, mostly...
7. The glowing aspects of the game that just look ugly and dumbs the game down. Take the original gameplay trailer as example. The skeletons have glowing shields, the entire area under the dungeon is glowing. There's virtually no realistic firelight radius at all. The glowing weapons on the barbarian that deal extra lightning/ice damage is way to excessive. It's just all too pretty for diablo 3. Just refer to this picture again.
I'm fine with the glowing shields. And, I REALLY like the excessive elemental effects on weapons. It's not too pretty for Diablo. Go back to Diablo 2 and throw on some paladin auras. They're pretty, aren't they? Shit, the first half of the first gameplay trailer is about the only thing I've liked so far.
Only 4 characters per game based on how intense the visuals are. Here's an idea... tone the visuals down? The combat doesn't have to be a giant glowing rainbow bomb unless they want it to be.
I'd go with 5 characters a game and call it good. It doesn't bother me since I'll probably play single player, but I can understand why this upsets you guys.
None-changing area's. Only dungeons are randomly changed. The outside world is static. I find this completely boring if the level cap will be 60 and if we will finish hell by level 60 I see a very boring game that will be a lot less repetitive than D2.
This will be a long post but it should be fairly interesting if you are looking forward to diablo 3, so don't dismiss it right away please.
Imho I am worried about diablo 3. Hear me out please and take all my points into consideration. I feel that they are not being original enough with diablo 3. Yes I am going to say it, "world of warcraft" but really I don't have any problem whatsoever with that game. In fact when I played it I enjoyed it thoroughly. The only reason I quit playing was because it ended up becoming more like an actual job rather than fun. My real quarrel is that they just aren't being original enough with diablo 3 and maybe they simply lost their blizzard touch on this one.
Again if you are still with me, hear me out please because I would really like to get my point across in detail. I will list a bunch of reasons regarding why I've decided I am worried about diablo 3 and potentially future blizzard games. Some regard to WoW, some regard to the game itself, some points just regarding blizzard in general. Keep in mind my main focus here isn't to compare it to WoW its simply to compare my points to the unoriginality that's being pushed on Diablo 3.
I will be bringing up some old points and some new ones. But again, I would really like you to follow through with me, Look and see where I am coming from because really, I am worried about D3 and future blizz products. I have no doubt D3 will be fun but it isn't the diablo 3 I envisioned when I was imagining what it would be like when I was playing diablo 2. I know everyone out there that played D2 envisioned what a diablo 3 would be like in their own minds. I have to say that I didn't envision D3 to be anything like what they were/are creating.
I will list my reasons for the personal conclusion that I've come to and please keep an open mind. This comes down to originality and making diablo 3 as good as it can be and what it should/could have been like with the right minds doing the right job.
1.My link This is a link to the dark cultist. Copy and paste undead WoW. They could have been a bit more original on this. Yes doing things like this saves time but... it just cuts the originality of Diablo and its sequel #3 like a hot knife through butter. And let's be honest with each other, if they are going to do something as obvious as this WHO KNOWS how many more of these there could be in the game that were just copy and pasted?
2. Diablo 3 items when they first released information about them were originally going to be in a unique- then -epic order with epic items being purple colored and the best you could get until the community outraged and it was changed (at least I think it was changed?). Even if it wasn't changed the point stands on an originality basis.
3. The original Character screen U.I that can be seen in the original gameplay trailer found on the D3 website. Basically copy and pasted from world of warcraft. Again, it isn't WoW being the problem, its the unoriginal eye being scoured into D3 like some hot twisted piece of metal. Yes it was changed for the better, but what kind of product would we have got if we never said anything about their work??
4. The stylized art style. I know its a hot topic and we all know it isn't going to change because it would basically be resetting everything they have done. That isn't the point though and I'm not asking them to change it I'm just dropping it into the melting pot of my overall concerns.
When I first envisioned diablo 3 I envisioned something like this. My link
I really have to admit that I did not envision anything like this.. My link
5. Health orbs. Yes they feel very arcade like and everyone knows they could do a better job on it rather than putting floating red globes everywhere for health. We all know there can't be any more potion spamming because that just doesn't work but floating red balls that pop out of enemies? Come on, we all know they can do better than this.
6. 60 level limit now. I think this speaks for itself. Nothing really wrong with it but it isn't original for diablo 3, it isn't a good idea in my opinion and it kind of ruins skill tree's based on the fact that you wont have the amount of points to play around with that you did in D2. Once you finish hell you should be level 60. I'm just wondering if there's going to be mounts at 40 now based on this unoriginality thumb print that I can't seem to watch out of my eyes for diablo 3. Just because something works in another game doesn't mean its the best solution and the best idea.
7. The glowing aspects of the game that just look ugly and dumbs the game down. Take the original gameplay trailer as example. The skeletons have glowing shields, the entire area under the dungeon is glowing. There's virtually no realistic firelight radius at all. The glowing weapons on the barbarian that deal extra lightning/ice damage is way to excessive. It's just all too pretty for diablo 3. Just refer to this picture again. My link This is what it's all about. Not ridiculous amounts of glowing objects/areas however that seems to be the theme on what diablo 3 is based around.
8. Only 4 characters per game based on how intense the visuals are. Here's an idea... tone the visuals down? The combat doesn't have to be a giant glowing rainbow bomb unless they want it to be.
9. None-changing area's. Only dungeons are randomly changed. The outside world is static. I find this completely boring if the level cap will be 60 and if we will finish hell by level 60 I see a very boring game that will be a lot less repetitive than D2.
At the moment I can't think of any other reasons to prove my point that I am very concerned with diablo 3 and concerned for diablo 3's unoriginality and the ideas and gameplay that made blizzard what it did at the time of D2//warcraft 3. When I look at diablo 3 what pops into my mind on what they have done so far is "what was the easiest solution", "What can we copy and paste that will work?", "lets do what will save the most time and resources". Imho Those are the first things that pop into my head when I take a real good look at Diablo 3 so far, I'm just worried about diablo 3 and future blizzard products in general if they are going to keep doing this crap again and again. I mean just think about what we would end up with if we didn't voice ANY concerns about the game at all. Really think about that and re-read my points as much as you want. Just remember, what would we get if we didn't say anything about their progress?
Anyway, I hope you thought this was interesting and at least insightful on some level or another. In the end I personally wont be getting the "OMG THAT IS AMAZING!" Diablo 3 that I expected I would be. Instead I will be getting the handmedown unoriginal game created for the masses. Fun may it still be, the point is what it could have been. In the end my main goal with this was to at least open some peoples eye's just a little bit so we don't end up accepting everything we get without question. If we do that we will all end up like console gamers in the very near future.
Okay i'm going to go Point by Point counter assesment.
1.Okay so what you're telling me with this point is that you think Diablo should no longer have any undead in the game based on its "un-originality"... did I get that right? My point is this, You can't have hell's minions without some sort of undead. All the cultists do are summon small beasts that deal massive damage. How is this a direct copy of WoW's undead?
2. What is so bad about unique-epic? It isn't unoriginal at all in fact Diablo was the first to use Unique items, and so what if Epic is better all they did was borrow from their other franchise which isn't unoriginality if they made it.
3. Again WoW got their Bar from the most basic Hot Bar system. Where would you have liked Diablo to go with this one. There are still mouse based skills exactly like D2 only it is in a condensed bar that doesn't take up the entire bottom portion of the screen. In fact looking at the UI looks completely normal and new If you haven't noticed WoW has your guy standing in the center of the Character U.I in Diablo your guy is not present so again I don't understand what your gripe about "unoriginality" is.
4. Alright Alright enough with this "art style is too pretty for me cause I am monochromatic" Honestly lighten up the world is rebuilding there was a twenty year break in between D2 and D3 grass grows and so do trees, rains fall and rainbows form it is called life. If you have problems with this game not being dark enough go look at the tristram footage. IT is in a graveyard and there is a pile of dead bodies in a huge wagon somewhere.
5.Health orbs are perfectly fine. They do what they need to and they tell you when they do it. Instead of just dishing out health for hitting a monster you have to actually pick this thing up which makes you think more than just "oh hey, I need health i'll just run in and attack." It presents a challenge to the player, such as in "Oh crap I have 26 HP, How do i get through these five Dark Cultists and make it to the health orb in time"
6. Level 99 serves absolutely NO PURPOSE WHATSOEVER! I don't understand what the obsession is with it being 100 or 99. 99 took a long ass time to get to constant Baal runs and it gets boring. Level 60 is absolutely fine and just cause they did it like WoW doesn't mean it unoriginal WoW took most of it's shit from diablo so you can say WoW is an upgrade to Diablo.
7. I have literally never been more stunned in my life. How can you say that you don't want to see your axe have lightning bolts flying erratically out of your axe? IT just looks awesome, and seeing the coldness steam off your axe is killer, and the insane fire effect on your maul what is so bad about this?. Skill effects make half the game. When i wanna rain blizzards on enemies I wanna see it in high detail with maximum effect and watch my enemies freeze and crack under it. I don't want some lame toned downed effects.
8. Again the effects are fine 4 players is fine as well. How many do you want? 9? It just isn't needed. You can beat the game with four and you can have fun watching kick-ass spells and blood and guts flying everywhere from your enemies. This is why i love this game. THERES BOATLOADS OF GORE!
9. I sort of agree here. It kind of kills re-playability, but at the same time it helps people out. Instead of having to wander aimlessly hoping to find the opening to Stony field, it is west 45 degrees every time. It just makes it easier. And i kind of like it this way because It makes it a lot more linear and I'll know where I have to go. If i want to fight enemies I can go into dungeons and fight them there. They will be random and new every time.
The first thing that pops into my head when they made this game. "Let's color it a bit instead of using the same old Mono Chromatic colors we used in previous games.","Let's turn up the effects so people can admire their kick ass gear and skills and watch the blood fly out instead of having 20 people do the same exact thing.", "Let's do what makes it easier for our players, let's get advanced mechanics for old timers and easy new ones for newcomers of all ages."
And You are completely wrong about it being made for the masses. Indeed they need newcomers clearly kids ten years ago don't have the same time they do now to play their game. They of course want new people to come but how often do you see games like this come out, Oh thats right NEVER! Not many people like these types of games either, if you haven't noticed it has to have a gun or the masses hate it. The only game i can find close to this game that currently out is Dragon age and Torchlight all other games like this just seem to lack what Diablo emphasized, the blood the guts the gore. The darkness is what makes this game. Also, by darkness i don't mean turn everything gray red and black I mean the looks the depth of the gore the amount of it the eeriness of places.
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Not even Death will save you from Diablo Bunny's Cuteness!
So why couldn't Diablo 3 have random generated areas that look as good as you want them? You are suggesting it isn't possible
That is what they said, and, from my experience with games, is largely correct. I'm more inclined to believe the word of a multi-billion dollar company than a random forum poster, and, in addition, it makes obvious sense.
I disagree and think it would add a lot more playability and flavor to the game if they added it in.
I didn't said it wouldn't add flavor to the game.
The diablo 2 was only a reference in that time period. Back in 2000 devs didn't have the technology they do now. I don't understand the unoriginal and half-assed attitude being taken with diablo 3.
I hardly call working on the same game for, what was it, six years? five? half-assed. I think a minority of the Diablo fan base, just like any other, automatically opts for the negative. Fine. I can understand that. It's a game most of us have invested more than ten years and countless tens of thousands of play hours in. It's a game I've been writing about for years. It's a game I've devoted a large portion of my life to for years. I can understand that.
What I don't understand is how this handful of pessimistic fans can go about boldly declaring what the team can and cannot do within the constraints that they've given themselves. They want this game to run on a wide range of modern-low grade computers. As such, including countless numbers of extra tiles, graphics, and algorithms to account for completely randomizing the entire overworld while making it still as aethetically beautiful as a semi-static map seems far-fetched to me.
Similarly, completely randomizing the entire overworld doesn't make practical sense. That would be like me going outside every day and having Denise Drive point in a different direction, maybe one day with a cliff. Sure, it would be awesome to not have a redundant morning routine, but I seriously doubt anyone is going to be complaining when they can actually say that the overworld is an actual overworld, alive, breathing, and matching up with a consistent map like a real RPG would. It becomes annoying to no good end. It's not refreshing. It's not awesome at the end of the day. I don't want to come home from work and college and have to rediscover every road that I already traveled a million times because it suddenly decided to move.
Randomization is great for other things, lots of other things. I'm not saying it's bad. I just feel that in this situation it has very little to offer me and the player community at large. Less time clearing game fog and more time killing what you want and need to kill. Less junk on my harddrive that I don't care about and basically just annoys me. Less punishing players for their time investments.
Furthermore, the VAST majority of the games in the past has been spent in dungeons and caves, grinding, looting, et cetera. Sure, I can understand those being randomized. I'll throw a concession there. There's simply no point spending all the additional assets (time, money, disc space) in making a flawless, randomizing overworld when I seriously doubt we'll be outside much if it really inherited the spirit of the series. I'd much rather go around the overworld knowing where I'm going after I've already traveled it, going sight-seeing at my leisure, if I so choose to.
But of course since we're both convinced our opinions are absolute, this isn't really going to go anywhere. The points in bold are my main arguments. Just quote them and save yourself some skimming time.
BTW, please stop trolling, guys. It's a game series and you're on a fansite. It just doesn't bode well for your maturity. We might end up having a chat, otherwise.
Imho Werehamster I'm just basically saying that when you put every piece of negative information together into one big melting pot it's something to take a good look at. Not even negative stuff, just unoriginal designs and things that I never expected to see in D3.
Again it comes down to a very high expectation of what diablo 3 could have been and how it doesn't seem like they coulda made it as good as it could have been and the directions they take on a lot of things in the game.
Imho it will be good, but it isn't going to be the amazing game that I been waiting 6-7 years for. Just take a look at that picture I posted. You can't deny that it looks freaking badass lol and that really shoulda been what D3 looked like.
Hell I even made that picture my desktop backround for how amazing it is.
I'm just basically saying that when you put every piece of negative information together into one big melting pot it's something to take a good look at. Not even negative stuff, just unoriginal designs and things that I never expected to see in D3.
from all the things i've read about Diablo III so far, the only truly original thing in the game is ironically enough, the Health Globe mechanic.
everything else existed elsewhere too (from the previous games to other games from any company).
The thing is that (as Jay Wilson said very well) you dont have to reinvent the wheel every time you need to do something. someone did it well and it fits? it goes in. its quite simple and it works.
*edit*
and for those saying Diablo III is going "childish"...
Guy has a point. D3 is going to be cool and all but it had way more potential. Not that I've played.. but just from what I've seen, this isn't what I envisioned D3 was going to look like.
I wish it was darker and had a more gothic vibe like the prequels (yes, still whining because of it.). Wish they hadn't decided to go with a kid-friendly approach which they obviously did. Diablo 1 scared the shit out of me when I was a kid watching my bro play, I remember it giving me nightmares, I don't see Diablo 3 giving any kids nightmares. Maybe dreams about pink unicorns and fluffy clouds but that's about it.
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Embrace this moment. Remember... We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion.
I wish it was darker and had a more gothic vibe like the prequels (yes, still whining because of it.). Wish they hadn't decided to go with a kid-friendly approach which they obviously did.
u should read all the post in the thread..just saying..some1 already clarified that D3 is about evil returning to the world not like D2 where evil took over the world..
so obviously when u start the game is more bright and rainbowish because its been 20 years without evil... but like every1 is saying as u go more far in your acts it becomes more and more darker and evil..
also its a good thing they did it this way because u can actually feel the progress you are making as you go further.. whats the point in starting in a dark hole and ending in a dark hole.
The OP is putting WAY to much thought into a game that isn't even in Beta. TBH this is the exact same BS that went around during the period I was an active member of these forums... about 2 years ago >.<...
Thankfully someone else has answered each of your points.
I do not believe that castlevania image is good at all, in fact I think it's terrible. It looks ok static, but it's so grainy and try hard "gritty" that moving around on it would make your eyes bleed.
Is a more accurate representation of the game.
Also, comparing it to wow, is automatic fail.
agreed and fry ice agreed always keep them on the toes you learn better from mistakes then doing something right...sry drunk...dost help my creditbitily...<spelled wrong LOL
~Mike~
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Is it awesome because its called diablo 3?
I never questioned if it would be "fun". However the looks and feels in no way "awesome".
Also ScyberDragon you didn't understand my point on the u.i. I guess I worded it wrong. I was talking about the character screen page that has the characters equipment and such in the old trailer.
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Unless you can get an exact quote on where they said that it was place holder I believe on this point you are wrong.
A place holder was also said to be in place for the dark cultist but that was never true either. In truth if the community never spoke up it could have been in the final product.
So why couldn't Diablo 3 have random generated areas that look as good as you want them? You are suggesting it isn't possible (I think? Not really sure what you are suggesting). I disagree and think it would add a lot more playability and flavor to the game if they added it in. The diablo 2 was only a reference in that time period. Back in 2000 devs didn't have the technology they do now. I don't understand the unoriginal and half-assed attitude being taken with diablo 3.
There is nothing wrong with the grammar, spelling, or sentence structure.
Oh sorry, I didn't realize that Kgydkgyd was an actual person. Sorry bro. I thought you were referring to me lol.
And mosts of your points didn't make any sense, also with references that didn't back up your points. But I agree with your worrying. But not for any of the reasons.
Ok well I'm sorry but please do your research before you try to complain....for one the whole entire game is random... including the reg maps they said you could play threw the game untill the next would come out and still almost always have different maps so no repetitive there they fixed that learning from D2... On that note Jay said him self that the further you get in the game the more "dark" "griter" "gloomy" it will get...evil is returning into the world JUST NOW in D3... in D2 evil already took over the world...they want us to see the transition of the world of the sanctuary and how its getting to be evil and bad agin further we go closer to hell more death, blood, darkness ECT>>>(ps a reminder this is not the same team that made D2 and please alot of people including you are comparing D3 to D2 remember its Diablo 3 not Diablo 2....).
For 2 remember they are the gods in that game(meaning blizz and the programmers) they can make 60 lvls still feel like 99 its just they have room to move content (plus they said it will be just as long as D2 hence now theres room to get better items and more skills ETC>>>)I do agree the the originality on the game is a little less then usally. But still have faith your only judging what they allowed to see just...there not gonna show you the biggest baddest boss in the deepest darkest deeps of hell are they? noo wow repeat...lol I mad a thread about this when they first announced D3 thats how i got into this web site i made a account just for something that you are saying...trust me I' pretty sure I'm a wiki my self...I've watched every interview...read almost any important thread on here rather I put my 2 cents in or not (including some random threads :)) each blizz con ( tried to go to this years its D3s blizzcon dident get tickets in time...:()this is the most I have ever been excited about a game EVER ive been keeping up in info.. somethings I like somethings I dont but remember they are doing it to innovate the game
3.The whole the whole UI thing...ya ok a lil wowish too but they did that so instead of haveing to switch from 2 diff skills now you have 7 so that i like (plus they are trying to put more pvp aspects into D3 trying to make a lil competive hopefully that will be nice...2 out of 3 of there BIG games are on the competive map why not put the last one up? I think it would be awsome)so really I think they did the whole UI thing for PvP. Plus more combos/interesting moves/builds
imho I think we should at least have 5 people in a game... I would like 1 of every class to be able to be in the game at once...and I like chaos idc... everyones getting good computers...if your a pc gamer and you dont have a dou core at least then your not a pc gamer...sorry... I think we should have the choice of how many people we want or something in that general direction...because I think of 10+ friends and I are getting D3 and we cant play together...
DUMB...
all I can say is just wait till the game comes out...
ps agree about the globe thing and
Thankfully someone else has answered each of your points.
I do not believe that castlevania image is good at all, in fact I think it's terrible. It looks ok static, but it's so grainy and try hard "gritty" that moving around on it would make your eyes bleed.
Is a more accurate representation of the game.
Also, comparing it to wow, is automatic fail.
I thought I was about to enter a thread where I'd agree with the OP, but then you criticized the Dark Cultists. The cultists are, in my opinion, the most diablo looking monsters in the game. Are you mad?
I don't like the art style either. Not much else to say about it now. Like you said, they can't exactly change it this far into the game.
That makes two of us.
I'm in the minority on health globes. I like them, and I prefer the original design.
I agree with what Bashiok said about levels, mostly...
I'm fine with the glowing shields. And, I REALLY like the excessive elemental effects on weapons. It's not too pretty for Diablo. Go back to Diablo 2 and throw on some paladin auras. They're pretty, aren't they? Shit, the first half of the first gameplay trailer is about the only thing I've liked so far.
I'd go with 5 characters a game and call it good. It doesn't bother me since I'll probably play single player, but I can understand why this upsets you guys.
Agree with Scyber on this.
Okay i'm going to go Point by Point counter assesment.
1.Okay so what you're telling me with this point is that you think Diablo should no longer have any undead in the game based on its "un-originality"... did I get that right? My point is this, You can't have hell's minions without some sort of undead. All the cultists do are summon small beasts that deal massive damage. How is this a direct copy of WoW's undead?
2. What is so bad about unique-epic? It isn't unoriginal at all in fact Diablo was the first to use Unique items, and so what if Epic is better all they did was borrow from their other franchise which isn't unoriginality if they made it.
3. Again WoW got their Bar from the most basic Hot Bar system. Where would you have liked Diablo to go with this one. There are still mouse based skills exactly like D2 only it is in a condensed bar that doesn't take up the entire bottom portion of the screen. In fact looking at the UI looks completely normal and new If you haven't noticed WoW has your guy standing in the center of the Character U.I in Diablo your guy is not present so again I don't understand what your gripe about "unoriginality" is.
4. Alright Alright enough with this "art style is too pretty for me cause I am monochromatic" Honestly lighten up the world is rebuilding there was a twenty year break in between D2 and D3 grass grows and so do trees, rains fall and rainbows form it is called life. If you have problems with this game not being dark enough go look at the tristram footage. IT is in a graveyard and there is a pile of dead bodies in a huge wagon somewhere.
5.Health orbs are perfectly fine. They do what they need to and they tell you when they do it. Instead of just dishing out health for hitting a monster you have to actually pick this thing up which makes you think more than just "oh hey, I need health i'll just run in and attack." It presents a challenge to the player, such as in "Oh crap I have 26 HP, How do i get through these five Dark Cultists and make it to the health orb in time"
6. Level 99 serves absolutely NO PURPOSE WHATSOEVER! I don't understand what the obsession is with it being 100 or 99. 99 took a long ass time to get to constant Baal runs and it gets boring. Level 60 is absolutely fine and just cause they did it like WoW doesn't mean it unoriginal WoW took most of it's shit from diablo so you can say WoW is an upgrade to Diablo.
7. I have literally never been more stunned in my life. How can you say that you don't want to see your axe have lightning bolts flying erratically out of your axe? IT just looks awesome, and seeing the coldness steam off your axe is killer, and the insane fire effect on your maul what is so bad about this?. Skill effects make half the game. When i wanna rain blizzards on enemies I wanna see it in high detail with maximum effect and watch my enemies freeze and crack under it. I don't want some lame toned downed effects.
8. Again the effects are fine 4 players is fine as well. How many do you want? 9? It just isn't needed. You can beat the game with four and you can have fun watching kick-ass spells and blood and guts flying everywhere from your enemies. This is why i love this game. THERES BOATLOADS OF GORE!
9. I sort of agree here. It kind of kills re-playability, but at the same time it helps people out. Instead of having to wander aimlessly hoping to find the opening to Stony field, it is west 45 degrees every time. It just makes it easier. And i kind of like it this way because It makes it a lot more linear and I'll know where I have to go. If i want to fight enemies I can go into dungeons and fight them there. They will be random and new every time.
The first thing that pops into my head when they made this game. "Let's color it a bit instead of using the same old Mono Chromatic colors we used in previous games.","Let's turn up the effects so people can admire their kick ass gear and skills and watch the blood fly out instead of having 20 people do the same exact thing.", "Let's do what makes it easier for our players, let's get advanced mechanics for old timers and easy new ones for newcomers of all ages."
And You are completely wrong about it being made for the masses. Indeed they need newcomers clearly kids ten years ago don't have the same time they do now to play their game. They of course want new people to come but how often do you see games like this come out, Oh thats right NEVER! Not many people like these types of games either, if you haven't noticed it has to have a gun or the masses hate it. The only game i can find close to this game that currently out is Dragon age and Torchlight all other games like this just seem to lack what Diablo emphasized, the blood the guts the gore. The darkness is what makes this game. Also, by darkness i don't mean turn everything gray red and black I mean the looks the depth of the gore the amount of it the eeriness of places.
That is what they said, and, from my experience with games, is largely correct. I'm more inclined to believe the word of a multi-billion dollar company than a random forum poster, and, in addition, it makes obvious sense.
I didn't said it wouldn't add flavor to the game.
I hardly call working on the same game for, what was it, six years? five? half-assed. I think a minority of the Diablo fan base, just like any other, automatically opts for the negative. Fine. I can understand that. It's a game most of us have invested more than ten years and countless tens of thousands of play hours in. It's a game I've been writing about for years. It's a game I've devoted a large portion of my life to for years. I can understand that.
What I don't understand is how this handful of pessimistic fans can go about boldly declaring what the team can and cannot do within the constraints that they've given themselves. They want this game to run on a wide range of modern-low grade computers. As such, including countless numbers of extra tiles, graphics, and algorithms to account for completely randomizing the entire overworld while making it still as aethetically beautiful as a semi-static map seems far-fetched to me.
Similarly, completely randomizing the entire overworld doesn't make practical sense. That would be like me going outside every day and having Denise Drive point in a different direction, maybe one day with a cliff. Sure, it would be awesome to not have a redundant morning routine, but I seriously doubt anyone is going to be complaining when they can actually say that the overworld is an actual overworld, alive, breathing, and matching up with a consistent map like a real RPG would. It becomes annoying to no good end. It's not refreshing. It's not awesome at the end of the day. I don't want to come home from work and college and have to rediscover every road that I already traveled a million times because it suddenly decided to move.
Randomization is great for other things, lots of other things. I'm not saying it's bad. I just feel that in this situation it has very little to offer me and the player community at large. Less time clearing game fog and more time killing what you want and need to kill. Less junk on my harddrive that I don't care about and basically just annoys me. Less punishing players for their time investments.
Furthermore, the VAST majority of the games in the past has been spent in dungeons and caves, grinding, looting, et cetera. Sure, I can understand those being randomized. I'll throw a concession there. There's simply no point spending all the additional assets (time, money, disc space) in making a flawless, randomizing overworld when I seriously doubt we'll be outside much if it really inherited the spirit of the series. I'd much rather go around the overworld knowing where I'm going after I've already traveled it, going sight-seeing at my leisure, if I so choose to.
But of course since we're both convinced our opinions are absolute, this isn't really going to go anywhere. The points in bold are my main arguments. Just quote them and save yourself some skimming time.
BTW, please stop trolling, guys. It's a game series and you're on a fansite. It just doesn't bode well for your maturity. We might end up having a chat, otherwise.
Again it comes down to a very high expectation of what diablo 3 could have been and how it doesn't seem like they coulda made it as good as it could have been and the directions they take on a lot of things in the game.
Imho it will be good, but it isn't going to be the amazing game that I been waiting 6-7 years for. Just take a look at that picture I posted. You can't deny that it looks freaking badass lol and that really shoulda been what D3 looked like.
Hell I even made that picture my desktop backround for how amazing it is.
from all the things i've read about Diablo III so far, the only truly original thing in the game is ironically enough, the Health Globe mechanic.
everything else existed elsewhere too (from the previous games to other games from any company).
The thing is that (as Jay Wilson said very well) you dont have to reinvent the wheel every time you need to do something. someone did it well and it fits? it goes in. its quite simple and it works.
*edit*
and for those saying Diablo III is going "childish"...
and that's just act 2 for all we know. yes, it does go darker (and bloodier) as we progress.
I wish it was darker and had a more gothic vibe like the prequels (yes, still whining because of it.). Wish they hadn't decided to go with a kid-friendly approach which they obviously did. Diablo 1 scared the shit out of me when I was a kid watching my bro play, I remember it giving me nightmares, I don't see Diablo 3 giving any kids nightmares. Maybe dreams about pink unicorns and fluffy clouds but that's about it.
Embrace this moment. Remember...
We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion.
u should read all the post in the thread..just saying..some1 already clarified that D3 is about evil returning to the world not like D2 where evil took over the world..
so obviously when u start the game is more bright and rainbowish because its been 20 years without evil... but like every1 is saying as u go more far in your acts it becomes more and more darker and evil..
also its a good thing they did it this way because u can actually feel the progress you are making as you go further.. whats the point in starting in a dark hole and ending in a dark hole.
agreed and fry ice agreed always keep them on the toes you learn better from mistakes then doing something right...sry drunk...dost help my creditbitily...<spelled wrong LOL
~Mike~