Did some of you even read the article? They said that Act 4 was cut short in D2 because of production time but that is NOT why they are doing it. They are doing it to help drive the story. This is how it works in all great stories. There is 80% build up (acts 1-3) and then a quick climax to the story (act4). They are not cutting out content to get the game out quicker. They have said that they want the story in D3 to really stand out and this is how you do it in a literary way. From a game design side, it FEELS like we are loosing content but we are not. It's not like they would not add more content if they felt it was necessary.
Because of this pre-planned idea to have final act shorter, they can design it this way. Act 4 in D2 sucked becuase it wasn't planned to be so short. D3 wants it this way and it will be dEveloped as so. If anything, it will feel more full than the other acts because people will have had their anticipation filled and will want to get to the final fight against diablo. This anticipation and climax will leave you more than satisfied after finishing the game. Much more so than adding a few more hours of hacking and slashing just to extend gameplay time.
(please note the obvious words of climax and satisfied. A great story should follow in line with great sex).
My opinion of d2 is that they were pressured to release the game on a diminished date and make some money. Remember... back in 2000 they didn't have WOW to bring them a constant flow of cash and therefore relied solely on the cash they made with warcraft/starcraft and the 1st Diablo. To me this was a perfect reason to shorten the length of some acts and consequently reduce act 4 to a mere 3 quests. To me, act IV was hollow and missed the whole feeling of dread and destruction. It wasn't long enoughs and varied enough to make you feel like you were about to kill the baddest demon of the flock. It definitely needed more quests, probably 1 or 2 more. More importantly, it needed more CONTENT! There was a flagrant lack of something that would be interesting story and lore wise. IDK... a certain demonic item to be retrieved or a damned wirt. Again that's just my perception, it missed that epicness I found in act 1-3.
With that being said, it's now obvious that the context is different with D3. They have WOW to keep the cash coming and they just released Starcraft 2 which is doing freaking well, so economically... Blizz can only be envied. Although Blizz said that they wanted to release a constant 2 games a year, I don't think that the higher ups want to pressure their dev teams to release an unfinished and unpolished game. The question remains, why cut on what's being created for act 4 if they have unlimited time and most of the work is done on act 1-3? Maybe it's because they want to keep some stuff for the expansion or it could be because most of the stuff is not important and doesn't add anything useful...or it could simply be a result of a personal choice just like removing the potions from the game.
When you look at D3, a game that took more than 5 years to make and you compare it to ... lets say, Uncharted 2 which took 3 years to make and broke IDK how many records, you're in right to ask yourself...why so much time? Why does it take 6-7 years to make a WOW graphically inspired game with a Diablo core gameplay? Seriously, make it 8 years and it's starting to look like Duke Nukem Forever :P. This is actually why I think the team wants to get D3 over with, because it's been so long since they began to work on it that they are starting to lose some juice. Both for the image of the game and the employee's sanity, they need to release the game ASAP! No one likes a game that takes forever and nothing is worst than working on a game that takes forever to develop :). Cutting on Act IV and some of the other acts, will give more time to work on PVP, Runes (animations) and polishing which, in return, will bring this beast of a game to completion... at last people will say.
They are not cutting anything! They are simply dividing the whole story into parts with the last section being the shortest. If they wanted it to be as long, they would divide the amount of content into each four acts equally. The last act will be short on purpose. It will not feel hollow like it did in d2 because they are planning it this way. They have all the content they need and are just dividing it to give it more of a climax. They are not saving time, money, or anything.
Thank you for the warm welcome to the site - I do apprecaite it!
I was a little rushed in my first reply - was late for the gym, but I had to respond because I read this article and got really excited because the wait is almost over. I agree with others that they are not necessarily cutting short the content and story of the game to prepare for a release date. If they did, that would suggest they are behind some schedule (not of their making) and for something as well put together as they have shown glimpses of, I can't find that being the case. I feel more than anything that a climatic slowdown of the story is motivated by nothing more than good story telling and a possible setup for expansions and patch content.
When I say that the game is ready to go, I mean its semi-complex and basic "guts" are done. I feel strongly that the fifth class has already been developed and was most likely ready to go when the barb was. There has to be an overall balance to each class and how they work with each other - not a process of "okay, now what can we add". They have the time to refine some content i.e. monsters, dungeon dynamics, etc - but the core of the game is there and complete. If they needed, this game could be put through its paces in the next couple of months for a holiday release, imo. The beta testing, I also feel, will be a short process. The game itself needs to be put through the basics of exploits, bad renders, unforeseen OP issues with either items or classes, but that can also be done through patching. SC2's beta process was long and complex, not necessarily to balance out the game, but to put the new BNet through its shakedown. Now that it is stable and ready to roll, D3 can move along with it.
Other titles, like Torchlight 2, I feel does not make Blizz quake in their boots. However you do have to consider the market share and its saturation. Blizz isn't hurting for money, but they are on the threshold of not only revamping their juggernaut of WoW, but re staking their claim on RTS games (SC2) and hack and slash. If each of these are a success, they will effectively stand yet again at the top of the mountain and look down at the other developers and exclaim "ner, ner, ner noobs." Something like Torchlight can steal that thunder - financially - which can slow down that excitement. People have limited budgets, both of money and time - they blow their wad on Torchlight and a quarter later D3 comes out, they may not have the ability to go for both. To us (die hard D2 fans) Torchlight is a filler until we get the real deal. There are so many others, that are perhaps console folk, who decide to get into the PC action and will go for the first game they can read about that is a hit. If Blizz misses the bus, they won't be hurting, because after all, their games are gold. However it can slow it down, which is never good. Also (as if this isn't long enough) someone else mentioned earlier that after the final class reveal and any other Artisan like surprises, they really have nothing left to keep the momentum going, short of the release date reveal. Imagine if you will, its February 2011 and you get another major update of a new monster they have developed, that is all gorey when it dies, isn't that cool - don't you want to keep waiting for our game? Nah. They've got a limited amount of time left before they start to lose people to other content, not least of all can be other Blizz games.
Last but not least - these are just my opinions. She Who Shall Not Be Named (wife) has a brother pretty high up in the industry and we recently spoke about some of these issues with Blizz and a lot of my opinions come from that conversation. However I still wake up almost each day and check the sites, hoping that they will say that the release date is tomorrow and that they are bringing back Ecto Cooler. Cause that s**t was the, um...s**t.
The fact of it being a personal choice makes me think that it can be both for the story and to shorten the dev process. I can't think of something else since the game has been in gestation for at least 5 years and that it's getting "late", per say.
Lol, diablo 3 makes me think of a situation where a guy has to wait to take a huge/urging piss and the guy occupying the bathroom says :" I'll be done, when i'll be done".
Lol, diablo 3 makes me think of a situation where a guy has to wait to take a huge/urging piss and the guy occupying the bathroom says :" I'll be done, when i'll be done".
I lol'd. Just some bugger sitting on the toilet, "SIR, I'LL BE DONE WHEN I'M DONE!"
Yeah, don't try to think too hard about this guys. Blizzcon is right around the corner, maybe we'll get a sneak peak into other acts and maybe some more story info.
Although, I hope they keep some crucial story info confidential. The reason being that, fuck, I've been waiting to see how the story ends forever, don't spoil it, dammit!
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I hate the way you cling to ignorance and pass it off as innocence
Okie after me an Akuma figured out it was all a misunderstanding and that were actually both okay dudes we of course started chatting about what we came here to chat about... The Game. Well he asked me an intersting question, and I think my response is close to reality, but then my reality sometimes is totally outta sink with the space-time continuum and I may be full of shit. So I thought we'd bring this out for a little open discussion... Here goes...
He asked:
Hey, by the way when you read the article Psyxix gave us did you feel that they are in a final phase where they are getting ready to bring everything up to shipment quality? Because I definitely felt that way and I'm hoping for a before-summer 2011 release
And I replied:
I'm actually thinking they are probably ready to start beta testing anytime. The game looks pretty polished and playable, but I suspect they are holding off on starting the beta until after Blizzcon. I think they wanna make a big splash at Blizzcon by releasing the fifth character class (which I'd bet my kidneys on it's gonna be ranged phys damage - something like the amazon).
If I had to guess they will give away a bunch of Beta keys to peeps at Blizzcon after the fifth class is unveiled, and we should see the beta starting somewhere around Haloween. Give the beta 4-6 months of solid testing, let em put a little more polsih on it and test the bnet servers, and poof it will hit the shelves. If I'm right we should be rockin by May-June of 2011.
So what do you gents think? My timeline near the mark or am I pissing in the wishing well?
Umm, well I would give my opinion, and I have no meaning to troll. But I think you're just making another topic page for another topic... That is still up.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Will be changed at some point, I'm too lazy right now.
I think you're spot on in your assumption, Rokkit. That's kinda how I feel too.
But, I still think that release will be later into the summer. I dunno why, but that's just what I see happening. But, I could see a June 28th release as well.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I hate the way you cling to ignorance and pass it off as innocence
I'm pretty sure they will be beta testing it. Blizz is big believers in beta tests, lets people like us try to find all the ways to break the game that they didn't think of.
Anyway if they stay true to form it will start as small closed beta with only blizz friends/family. Once they are sure the servers are stable they will opoen it up a bit and announce a sign up on the website. Then they will select the peeps for beta keys and start going. Typically they start with a few keys and then send out more as the beta goes on.
If all goes well and they don't have to make major changes I still think they will go beta for a few months. If theres some major code they need to fix it might go 5-6. But then thats just me speculating to, and I'm not Yoda :starwars:
Because of this pre-planned idea to have final act shorter, they can design it this way. Act 4 in D2 sucked becuase it wasn't planned to be so short. D3 wants it this way and it will be dEveloped as so. If anything, it will feel more full than the other acts because people will have had their anticipation filled and will want to get to the final fight against diablo. This anticipation and climax will leave you more than satisfied after finishing the game. Much more so than adding a few more hours of hacking and slashing just to extend gameplay time.
(please note the obvious words of climax and satisfied. A great story should follow in line with great sex).
With that being said, it's now obvious that the context is different with D3. They have WOW to keep the cash coming and they just released Starcraft 2 which is doing freaking well, so economically... Blizz can only be envied. Although Blizz said that they wanted to release a constant 2 games a year, I don't think that the higher ups want to pressure their dev teams to release an unfinished and unpolished game. The question remains, why cut on what's being created for act 4 if they have unlimited time and most of the work is done on act 1-3? Maybe it's because they want to keep some stuff for the expansion or it could be because most of the stuff is not important and doesn't add anything useful...or it could simply be a result of a personal choice just like removing the potions from the game.
When you look at D3, a game that took more than 5 years to make and you compare it to ... lets say, Uncharted 2 which took 3 years to make and broke IDK how many records, you're in right to ask yourself...why so much time? Why does it take 6-7 years to make a WOW graphically inspired game with a Diablo core gameplay? Seriously, make it 8 years and it's starting to look like Duke Nukem Forever :P. This is actually why I think the team wants to get D3 over with, because it's been so long since they began to work on it that they are starting to lose some juice. Both for the image of the game and the employee's sanity, they need to release the game ASAP! No one likes a game that takes forever and nothing is worst than working on a game that takes forever to develop :). Cutting on Act IV and some of the other acts, will give more time to work on PVP, Runes (animations) and polishing which, in return, will bring this beast of a game to completion... at last people will say.
They are not cutting anything! They are simply dividing the whole story into parts with the last section being the shortest. If they wanted it to be as long, they would divide the amount of content into each four acts equally. The last act will be short on purpose. It will not feel hollow like it did in d2 because they are planning it this way. They have all the content they need and are just dividing it to give it more of a climax. They are not saving time, money, or anything.
I was a little rushed in my first reply - was late for the gym, but I had to respond because I read this article and got really excited because the wait is almost over. I agree with others that they are not necessarily cutting short the content and story of the game to prepare for a release date. If they did, that would suggest they are behind some schedule (not of their making) and for something as well put together as they have shown glimpses of, I can't find that being the case. I feel more than anything that a climatic slowdown of the story is motivated by nothing more than good story telling and a possible setup for expansions and patch content.
When I say that the game is ready to go, I mean its semi-complex and basic "guts" are done. I feel strongly that the fifth class has already been developed and was most likely ready to go when the barb was. There has to be an overall balance to each class and how they work with each other - not a process of "okay, now what can we add". They have the time to refine some content i.e. monsters, dungeon dynamics, etc - but the core of the game is there and complete. If they needed, this game could be put through its paces in the next couple of months for a holiday release, imo. The beta testing, I also feel, will be a short process. The game itself needs to be put through the basics of exploits, bad renders, unforeseen OP issues with either items or classes, but that can also be done through patching. SC2's beta process was long and complex, not necessarily to balance out the game, but to put the new BNet through its shakedown. Now that it is stable and ready to roll, D3 can move along with it.
Other titles, like Torchlight 2, I feel does not make Blizz quake in their boots. However you do have to consider the market share and its saturation. Blizz isn't hurting for money, but they are on the threshold of not only revamping their juggernaut of WoW, but re staking their claim on RTS games (SC2) and hack and slash. If each of these are a success, they will effectively stand yet again at the top of the mountain and look down at the other developers and exclaim "ner, ner, ner noobs." Something like Torchlight can steal that thunder - financially - which can slow down that excitement. People have limited budgets, both of money and time - they blow their wad on Torchlight and a quarter later D3 comes out, they may not have the ability to go for both. To us (die hard D2 fans) Torchlight is a filler until we get the real deal. There are so many others, that are perhaps console folk, who decide to get into the PC action and will go for the first game they can read about that is a hit. If Blizz misses the bus, they won't be hurting, because after all, their games are gold. However it can slow it down, which is never good. Also (as if this isn't long enough) someone else mentioned earlier that after the final class reveal and any other Artisan like surprises, they really have nothing left to keep the momentum going, short of the release date reveal. Imagine if you will, its February 2011 and you get another major update of a new monster they have developed, that is all gorey when it dies, isn't that cool - don't you want to keep waiting for our game? Nah. They've got a limited amount of time left before they start to lose people to other content, not least of all can be other Blizz games.
Last but not least - these are just my opinions. She Who Shall Not Be Named (wife) has a brother pretty high up in the industry and we recently spoke about some of these issues with Blizz and a lot of my opinions come from that conversation. However I still wake up almost each day and check the sites, hoping that they will say that the release date is tomorrow and that they are bringing back Ecto Cooler. Cause that s**t was the, um...s**t.
Monkalicious: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/OptimusPrime-12194/hero/79139477
Lol, diablo 3 makes me think of a situation where a guy has to wait to take a huge/urging piss and the guy occupying the bathroom says :" I'll be done, when i'll be done".
I lol'd. Just some bugger sitting on the toilet, "SIR, I'LL BE DONE WHEN I'M DONE!"
Yeah, don't try to think too hard about this guys. Blizzcon is right around the corner, maybe we'll get a sneak peak into other acts and maybe some more story info.
Although, I hope they keep some crucial story info confidential. The reason being that, fuck, I've been waiting to see how the story ends forever, don't spoil it, dammit!
I hate the way you cling to ignorance and pass it off as innocence
He asked:
And I replied:
So what do you gents think? My timeline near the mark or am I pissing in the wishing well?
Peace!
I think you're spot on in your assumption, Rokkit. That's kinda how I feel too.
But, I still think that release will be later into the summer. I dunno why, but that's just what I see happening. But, I could see a June 28th release as well.
I hate the way you cling to ignorance and pass it off as innocence
Recruiting for East Realm
Also recruiting for Sc2 on both EU and NA servers
Bod home Page
Anyway I'm in the mid 2011 team. :sorcerer:
Canadian here all we have is basically EB games as our main source of gaming needs!
I'm pretty sure they will be beta testing it. Blizz is big believers in beta tests, lets people like us try to find all the ways to break the game that they didn't think of.
Anyway if they stay true to form it will start as small closed beta with only blizz friends/family. Once they are sure the servers are stable they will opoen it up a bit and announce a sign up on the website. Then they will select the peeps for beta keys and start going. Typically they start with a few keys and then send out more as the beta goes on.
If all goes well and they don't have to make major changes I still think they will go beta for a few months. If theres some major code they need to fix it might go 5-6. But then thats just me speculating to, and I'm not Yoda :starwars: