.
This “charge-up” attribute would not be like the Assassin’s charge-up skills where charges accumulate due to successive hits within a short time frame. This is a different idea that would apply to a variety of skills and spells... and every character class would have certain skills that would have the ability to charge-up the longer you hold down the trigger button (could be the mouse button, could be a keyboard button). Charged attacks would consume additional Mana (or Rage) while charging. They could also be interrupted if you are hit while charging. And, depending on the skill, you may be able to move around while charging or you may be required to stand still.
For example, a Sorceress would have to stand still as she charges up a savage and lethal Lightning Storm... and as soon as she reaches a full charge the Lightning Storm is automatically unleashed. A Barbarian, on the other hand, could be allowed to move while charging up his Whirlwind skill. He could also hold this charge until he finds a group of enemies to engage… but, of course, this would consume additional Rage as long as he is holding the full charge.
Now here is the great thing about being able to charge up your skills... It’s not just about adding extra damage points to your skills. Charged attacks would have the potential to unleash interesting side effects while they are charging, deliver combo attacks when they are unleashed and introduce extremely unique and interesting animations for your characters existing skills!
Picture a Sorceress on an elevated platform in a dungeon looking down at a cluster of demon champions below… she decides this is an excellent opportunity to unleash a charged up Blizzard spell... and so you hold the trigger down and she starts to wave her hands slowly and chant something... and the atmosphere begins to grow darker as the spell charges... and there is a visible wind that begins to grow stronger and the room starts to look colder... any demons around the Sorceress begin to move slower as they are becoming affected by the chill… debris is sucked towards the Sorceress and spins around her violently... snow flakes appear and flutter around... then finally, suddenly, a meteoric shit storm of snow and ice is unleashed that fills up your entire field of view delivering heavy damage to any demons in view... even the most cold resistant monsters are left frozen solid!
Or consider the Barbarian charging up his Cleave skill. You see a group of demons just up ahead so you hold the trigger down and charge up your Cleve skill completely as you approach them. You reach the pack of enemies and release the trigger… and instead of a single swoosh that you normally deliver with your Cleve skill, you perform a devastating triple hit combo attack where each hit has it’s own unique animation. Beautiful and well worth the wait! Charged up attacks would be a nice simple way to introduce elaborate combo moves for the Barb.
Of course, the amount of time required to unleash a fully charged spell would have to be carefully balanced for each skill. There would have to be a long enough pause between charges so that you are not able to spam the charged attacks or use them too easily while engaged in close quarter combat. There might also have to be a slightly longer than normal cool down period after using a fully charged attack. However, if you fear that you are about to be attacked while in the middle of a charge (and therefore interrupted) you should still be able to release the trigger and engage in a more-powerful-than-normal attack. So ultimately you would have to decide when the best moment to charge up the spell would be...
I believe "charging", if executed properly, could be a nice addition to skills in general. It has the potential to introduce new gameplay techniques, it could add to the general atmosphere of the game world and would really enhance the uniqueness of each character with the extra variety to the attack animations.
So what do you think? Do you see any limitations or have any suggestions to implement it better? What other skills could you see having a "charge" attribute added to it... and what would it look like?
OK.. well I'll try to imagine what a Fireball charge-up for the Sorcerer could be like (obviously I expect this class to be returning)...
He triggers the charge up for the fireball spell and starts to chant... a small globe of fire appears in front of him as he rises slightly above the ground... the globe of fire becomes more intense and the Sorcerer's armor begins glowing red hot.. then white.. the Sorcerer spontaneously combusts into a raging fireball that ignites anything that touches him... tendrils of fire shoot out across the ground from below his feet.. suddenly there is a deafening explosion as the fireball surrounding the Sorcerer erupts outwards in a supersonic explosion crushing most of the demons within the blast radius... and setting on fire whatever remains...
On a side note... I want to add that even though the descriptions of a charge-up may seem long when you read it, you have to picture all of these events happening within a few seconds. I think it would be reasonable to expect most charge-ups max out withing about 5 seconds... especially for the Barb, probably less than 5 seconds.
Umm, I think it would be cool, but not for Diablo... It just seems like it would kinda get boring, sitting there with your sorc for 5 seconds, charging up a skill... 5 seconds doesn't sound long, but it would be an eternaty...
Umm, I think it would be cool, but not for Diablo... It just seems like it would kinda get boring, sitting there with your sorc for 5 seconds, charging up a skill... 5 seconds doesn't sound long, but it would be an eternaty...
Quote from "bentic" »
5 seconds charging with skill cool down while getting beaten by 55 zombies is bad idea.
Well obviously you aren't even trying to offer constructive criticism. You see one flaw in one type of situation and somehow that's enough reason for you to disregard the whole idea of charging...
As mentioned in my original post the timing issue would have to be carefully balanced. I originally suggested certain limits like 5 and 10 seconds... but that was just wild estimate. You could probably execute charged skills much quicker. But it's pointless to speculate on how LONG these should take. That's not the real point of adding charge-ups to skills... so I'm sorry I even tried to estimate a time limit...
The main benefit of charging up skill is so that you can unleash different looking versions of the skill and possible side effects related to the core skill.
Consider the Barbs Cleve skill. Currently, every time he uses it it's just one big swipe of the blade with a big red streak. Sure it looks a lot nicer than what D2 had to offer... but I think it will just become mundane if there are no other ways to enhance the attack animation... Remember, the design of the Barb in D3 was admittedly influenced by God of War. I like that Blizzard decided to take some notes from that game... but I think they only went half way with it. Instead of creating a single animaion for the Cleave skill, why not open the door to larger combo moves and more attack animations with a simple charge-up? It's not complicated.. you can still play the game with "just the mouse"... and I think it helps give skills more depth.
Consider also some possible side effects:
- While charging up a Blizzard spell enemies around the Sorceress are slowed down.
- While charging up a Fireball spell the Sorceress begins to immolate and burn anything that gets near her.
These are just ideas... If you don't like the specific idea I have for a skill that doesn't mean that the original suggestion for charging-up skills has failed... it means you could offer a better suggestion.. or perhaps offer real reasons why charging would somehow not work...
Umm, I think it would be cool, but not for Diablo... It just seems like it would kinda get boring, sitting there with your sorc for 5 seconds, charging up a skill... 5 seconds doesn't sound long, but it would be an eternaty...
Also note.. that just because a skill has a charge-up option that does not mean you always have to wait the full charge period before using the skill... you don't have to wait 5 seconds ALL the time.
You can still insta-cast your spells as you would normally... but now you also have the OPTION to hold down the trigger to charge up your skill for something slightly different that is more effective. Charging up is an augmentation for certain skills.. not a replacement. I'm not trying to suggest longer cast times overall...
Maybe a sorc could charge up that fireball and move around with it then release it on the boss, but charging in mid battle would be rather worthless. I'm not saying that the idea is worthless, but charging mid fight should be less efficient, so charges are only used to start with.
Also, let say I have my charged fireball. I have to release that fireball before I can use another spell so I'm punished the mana/time if I come to a fire immune and must swap to my light attack etc.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"The gaming public now has focus on Diablo again, and with it comes the modern-age of trolling and jackassery."
Ooh! Some positive feedback, cool! I was excited about this idea and was getting worried that no one thought it had any merit...
Quote from "cjc5814" »
I like it as maybe an opening move.
...charging mid fight should be less efficient, so charges are only used to start with.
I agree that the charge-up attack should not be so easy to use that you can spam it in the middle of a fight. Charge-up attacks would be difficult to use once you are surrounded by enemies because if you are hit the charge-up is interrupted and canceled. Charging up would also incur mana drain while charging, and in some cases while holding the charge before using it.
After hacking up a group of monsters, I picture a Barbarian making his way to the next area of a dungeon while charging up his Cleve spell... he turns the corner to find a group of demons and opens up with a nice combo attack and finishes them off with normal usage of his skills.
Quote from "Ivaron" »
I think it's a cool idea. The only issue I see with it is that it takes time away from killing demons, if you know what I mean. Instead of it going "hack, hack hack, slash!" it'd go "veeeooooooomppppphhhhhhhhh .............. HACKSLASH!"
If the charge-up ability was balanced properly then it would encourage you to use the NORMAL attack more often than your charged attack. Most of the time you would not be in a position to charge up unless the opportunity presented itself.
So I think the action would be more like: hack, hack, hack, hack... veeeeeeop! SMASH! hack, hack, hack... veeeeeeeop! SMASH! hack, hack, hack...
And another problem would be that it's probably too easy, in the end, to charge up an attack while safely out of the way, and then release it once the enemies have approached you.
Thats probably the main issue, make skills only chargable when theres a monster in x radius.
Otherwise it would be very cool to charge up some elemental skills on bosses. Some melee skills would also be kickass ofcourse.
My original suggestion was that some skills could be charged while moving... while other skills could only be charged (and subsequently used) while standing in one spot. I think this would help prevent people from charging up really powerful spells while in complete safety and then carrying a charge over to a group of enemies.
Since I imagine the Barb being able to move around while charging up, the benefits he receives for a charged attack would be good, but not as great as the Sorceress who would be required to stand still for something like 5 seconds and she would have to be near a group of enemies... therefore it's more dangerous.
For example... the Barb would charge up his Cleave skill within about 3 seconds and the charged attack adds maybe 100% to his damage and hits multiple targets quickly. That's good for a nice opening move.
The Sorceress on the other hand with her Blizzard spell could do 200% more damage to all visible monsters in the area if she could reach a full charge in 5 seconds while standing still and without being hit. If there are a lot of ranged attackers in the area, you would have to decide that it would be best not to use the charged attack and just continue fighting with the normal attack.
Please don't think too hard about my estimates for timing and enhanced damage numbers... that's not the point. The point is there could be a difference between the benefits granted to skills you can charge while moving VS. skills you can only charge while standing still.
Check it out : I wrote a long a couple of paragraphs about a combo meter, it just got a little "off topic."
So instead, I'll start a new thread for that, and just comment on this.
I strongly believe that charging skills for every class is a terrible idea, but instead should be used by one or two classes. A spell-caster would be great, seeing as how they tend to have a bit of distance between them and the enemies in the first place. Another good one would be a rouge/amazon class, for the same reason.
I feel this way because I'm on this new kick, where I think there should be large fundemental gameplay differences between the classes.
what would a barb charge up be?........maybe he lowers his head and begins to run in place untiil you let go of the riggers sending him rocketing head first in his enemy.......but i wouldnt like the charge up as much this game seems to be taking pages out of Marvel: Ultimate Alliance
Check it out : I strongly believe that charging skills for every class is a terrible idea, but instead should be used by one or two classes...
I feel this way because I'm on this new kick, where I think there should be large fundemental gameplay differences between the classes.
I think charging could be integrated amongst all classes and you would still maintain distinct differences between the classes. In fact charging could *enhance* differences between characters. Just because all classes have have the ability to charge up a skill does not mean they would start to become more similar. There are lots of basic abilities that all characters have.. and I believe "charging" has the potential to enhance all character classes.
However... I don't think every class would be able to charge up every skill. For each class there would be a certain number of skills that actually had this option. Let's say each character has about 20 skills. On some characters (mages?) maybe 10 of these skills could have charging options.. and on other characters (melee?) maybe only 3 or 5 skills have the ability to charge. But that's hardly something we could even speculate on at this point because we only know a limited amount of information for only 2 classes... so there is not much point in guessing who should be able to utilize "charging" right now...
Quote from "illinvillain29" »
...but i wouldnt like the charge up as much this game seems to be taking pages out of Marvel: Ultimate Alliance
Well that's because you're probably picturing it in your head that way... but there are many ways to integrate Charging skills in the game without somehow turning the classes into a bunch of superheros!
This “charge-up” attribute would not be like the Assassin’s charge-up skills where charges accumulate due to successive hits within a short time frame. This is a different idea that would apply to a variety of skills and spells... and every character class would have certain skills that would have the ability to charge-up the longer you hold down the trigger button (could be the mouse button, could be a keyboard button). Charged attacks would consume additional Mana (or Rage) while charging. They could also be interrupted if you are hit while charging. And, depending on the skill, you may be able to move around while charging or you may be required to stand still.
For example, a Sorceress would have to stand still as she charges up a savage and lethal Lightning Storm... and as soon as she reaches a full charge the Lightning Storm is automatically unleashed. A Barbarian, on the other hand, could be allowed to move while charging up his Whirlwind skill. He could also hold this charge until he finds a group of enemies to engage… but, of course, this would consume additional Rage as long as he is holding the full charge.
Now here is the great thing about being able to charge up your skills... It’s not just about adding extra damage points to your skills. Charged attacks would have the potential to unleash interesting side effects while they are charging, deliver combo attacks when they are unleashed and introduce extremely unique and interesting animations for your characters existing skills!
Picture a Sorceress on an elevated platform in a dungeon looking down at a cluster of demon champions below… she decides this is an excellent opportunity to unleash a charged up Blizzard spell... and so you hold the trigger down and she starts to wave her hands slowly and chant something... and the atmosphere begins to grow darker as the spell charges... and there is a visible wind that begins to grow stronger and the room starts to look colder... any demons around the Sorceress begin to move slower as they are becoming affected by the chill… debris is sucked towards the Sorceress and spins around her violently... snow flakes appear and flutter around... then finally, suddenly, a meteoric shit storm of snow and ice is unleashed that fills up your entire field of view delivering heavy damage to any demons in view... even the most cold resistant monsters are left frozen solid!
Or consider the Barbarian charging up his Cleave skill. You see a group of demons just up ahead so you hold the trigger down and charge up your Cleve skill completely as you approach them. You reach the pack of enemies and release the trigger… and instead of a single swoosh that you normally deliver with your Cleve skill, you perform a devastating triple hit combo attack where each hit has it’s own unique animation. Beautiful and well worth the wait! Charged up attacks would be a nice simple way to introduce elaborate combo moves for the Barb.
Of course, the amount of time required to unleash a fully charged spell would have to be carefully balanced for each skill. There would have to be a long enough pause between charges so that you are not able to spam the charged attacks or use them too easily while engaged in close quarter combat. There might also have to be a slightly longer than normal cool down period after using a fully charged attack. However, if you fear that you are about to be attacked while in the middle of a charge (and therefore interrupted) you should still be able to release the trigger and engage in a more-powerful-than-normal attack. So ultimately you would have to decide when the best moment to charge up the spell would be...
I believe "charging", if executed properly, could be a nice addition to skills in general. It has the potential to introduce new gameplay techniques, it could add to the general atmosphere of the game world and would really enhance the uniqueness of each character with the extra variety to the attack animations.
So what do you think? Do you see any limitations or have any suggestions to implement it better? What other skills could you see having a "charge" attribute added to it... and what would it look like?
He triggers the charge up for the fireball spell and starts to chant... a small globe of fire appears in front of him as he rises slightly above the ground... the globe of fire becomes more intense and the Sorcerer's armor begins glowing red hot.. then white.. the Sorcerer spontaneously combusts into a raging fireball that ignites anything that touches him... tendrils of fire shoot out across the ground from below his feet.. suddenly there is a deafening explosion as the fireball surrounding the Sorcerer erupts outwards in a supersonic explosion crushing most of the demons within the blast radius... and setting on fire whatever remains...
On a side note... I want to add that even though the descriptions of a charge-up may seem long when you read it, you have to picture all of these events happening within a few seconds. I think it would be reasonable to expect most charge-ups max out withing about 5 seconds... especially for the Barb, probably less than 5 seconds.
Well obviously you aren't even trying to offer constructive criticism. You see one flaw in one type of situation and somehow that's enough reason for you to disregard the whole idea of charging...
As mentioned in my original post the timing issue would have to be carefully balanced. I originally suggested certain limits like 5 and 10 seconds... but that was just wild estimate. You could probably execute charged skills much quicker. But it's pointless to speculate on how LONG these should take. That's not the real point of adding charge-ups to skills... so I'm sorry I even tried to estimate a time limit...
The main benefit of charging up skill is so that you can unleash different looking versions of the skill and possible side effects related to the core skill.
Consider the Barbs Cleve skill. Currently, every time he uses it it's just one big swipe of the blade with a big red streak. Sure it looks a lot nicer than what D2 had to offer... but I think it will just become mundane if there are no other ways to enhance the attack animation... Remember, the design of the Barb in D3 was admittedly influenced by God of War. I like that Blizzard decided to take some notes from that game... but I think they only went half way with it. Instead of creating a single animaion for the Cleave skill, why not open the door to larger combo moves and more attack animations with a simple charge-up? It's not complicated.. you can still play the game with "just the mouse"... and I think it helps give skills more depth.
Consider also some possible side effects:
- While charging up a Blizzard spell enemies around the Sorceress are slowed down.
- While charging up a Fireball spell the Sorceress begins to immolate and burn anything that gets near her.
These are just ideas... If you don't like the specific idea I have for a skill that doesn't mean that the original suggestion for charging-up skills has failed... it means you could offer a better suggestion.. or perhaps offer real reasons why charging would somehow not work...
Also note.. that just because a skill has a charge-up option that does not mean you always have to wait the full charge period before using the skill... you don't have to wait 5 seconds ALL the time.
You can still insta-cast your spells as you would normally... but now you also have the OPTION to hold down the trigger to charge up your skill for something slightly different that is more effective. Charging up is an augmentation for certain skills.. not a replacement. I'm not trying to suggest longer cast times overall...
Maybe a sorc could charge up that fireball and move around with it then release it on the boss, but charging in mid battle would be rather worthless. I'm not saying that the idea is worthless, but charging mid fight should be less efficient, so charges are only used to start with.
Also, let say I have my charged fireball. I have to release that fireball before I can use another spell so I'm punished the mana/time if I come to a fire immune and must swap to my light attack etc.
Bashiok - Blizzard Poster
I agree that the charge-up attack should not be so easy to use that you can spam it in the middle of a fight. Charge-up attacks would be difficult to use once you are surrounded by enemies because if you are hit the charge-up is interrupted and canceled. Charging up would also incur mana drain while charging, and in some cases while holding the charge before using it.
After hacking up a group of monsters, I picture a Barbarian making his way to the next area of a dungeon while charging up his Cleve spell... he turns the corner to find a group of demons and opens up with a nice combo attack and finishes them off with normal usage of his skills.
If the charge-up ability was balanced properly then it would encourage you to use the NORMAL attack more often than your charged attack. Most of the time you would not be in a position to charge up unless the opportunity presented itself.
So I think the action would be more like: hack, hack, hack, hack... veeeeeeop! SMASH! hack, hack, hack... veeeeeeeop! SMASH! hack, hack, hack...
My original suggestion was that some skills could be charged while moving... while other skills could only be charged (and subsequently used) while standing in one spot. I think this would help prevent people from charging up really powerful spells while in complete safety and then carrying a charge over to a group of enemies.
Since I imagine the Barb being able to move around while charging up, the benefits he receives for a charged attack would be good, but not as great as the Sorceress who would be required to stand still for something like 5 seconds and she would have to be near a group of enemies... therefore it's more dangerous.
For example... the Barb would charge up his Cleave skill within about 3 seconds and the charged attack adds maybe 100% to his damage and hits multiple targets quickly. That's good for a nice opening move.
The Sorceress on the other hand with her Blizzard spell could do 200% more damage to all visible monsters in the area if she could reach a full charge in 5 seconds while standing still and without being hit. If there are a lot of ranged attackers in the area, you would have to decide that it would be best not to use the charged attack and just continue fighting with the normal attack.
Please don't think too hard about my estimates for timing and enhanced damage numbers... that's not the point. The point is there could be a difference between the benefits granted to skills you can charge while moving VS. skills you can only charge while standing still.
So instead, I'll start a new thread for that, and just comment on this.
I strongly believe that charging skills for every class is a terrible idea, but instead should be used by one or two classes. A spell-caster would be great, seeing as how they tend to have a bit of distance between them and the enemies in the first place. Another good one would be a rouge/amazon class, for the same reason.
I feel this way because I'm on this new kick, where I think there should be large fundemental gameplay differences between the classes.
I think charging could be integrated amongst all classes and you would still maintain distinct differences between the classes. In fact charging could *enhance* differences between characters. Just because all classes have have the ability to charge up a skill does not mean they would start to become more similar. There are lots of basic abilities that all characters have.. and I believe "charging" has the potential to enhance all character classes.
However... I don't think every class would be able to charge up every skill. For each class there would be a certain number of skills that actually had this option. Let's say each character has about 20 skills. On some characters (mages?) maybe 10 of these skills could have charging options.. and on other characters (melee?) maybe only 3 or 5 skills have the ability to charge. But that's hardly something we could even speculate on at this point because we only know a limited amount of information for only 2 classes... so there is not much point in guessing who should be able to utilize "charging" right now...
Well that's because you're probably picturing it in your head that way... but there are many ways to integrate Charging skills in the game without somehow turning the classes into a bunch of superheros!
true that very well could be correct.....but i still think D3 can do without the charge ability and the creators will leave it out