Must Skill: Battle Orders. I haven't seen a Barb. guide without pumping this skill. In fact when you create a Barb. you start with 20 less skill points. Why? Because you MUST maximise BO. Where is the fun with that?
A few examples of 1 Point Wonders: Battle Command, Sorc Cold Shields, Teleport, Static Field, Amplify Damage, Decrepify, Redemption, ...
A few examples of Useless Skills: Most of Necro curses, Potion/Item Find and Grim Ward, Inner Sight, Shadow Warrior, Thorns Aura, ...
In D2, half of the skills were useless or/and 1 Pt. wonders. They seem to me styleless, dishonorable, worthless skills who lack self-respect. This is not cool. Each skill should have its own usage and must be worthwhile to spend 20 skill points. This is the big deal in D3. Replace useless skills with charming skills and make 1 Pt. wonders more stylish so that we have to trade-off between them.
I think they were originally planning for people to invest less points in more skills, so they could meet the needs of the game and change their play styles accordingly. Then people began specializing in just a couple of skills which game rise to "Smiters" and "Whirlwind Barbs" and "Wind Druids". You probably could use some of those "useless skills" at specific parts of the game, but that requires more work and may be less effective than specialized builds.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Don't try to be a great man, just be a man... and let history make its own judgment. -Zefram Cochrane, Star Trek
Not to crash your party but I'm sure Blizzard are well aware of balancing issues... I mean, all of their franchises bring in gameplay / balance before, not to demean, their graphics.
1 point skills will, indeed, be capped to 1 point. So this isn't an issue. It just means that you won't be able to put 20 points into the 1 point wonders.
When Blizzard North Fell and Blizzard Entertainment began patching Diablo 2 and ruined it so that investing in a few skills was logical, what with that stupid skills benefiting eachother, which seriously killed the game for me and many others but drew in enough to satisfy them. you can basically blame the people that are making Diablo 3 now for what happened to diablo 2.
Congratulations for winning the misinformed post of the day award!
Back in 1.09, before synergies, you had less different builds, because less skills were viable. Wanted a Sorc? Had to use FO, Nova or Meteor, (or 2 of them). No other options worked effectively. Couldn't use CB, Lightning, Chain Lightning, Blizzard, Fireball etc...
Congrats to you too Arbedark, I couldn't have done it without my vastly superior skills.
Both before the synergy patch and after the synergy patch had builds that, to be honest, everyone on the planet used.
Before synergy we saw builds that pretty much consisted of pumping up top tier skills such as FO and Meteor.
After synergy we saw builds that pretty much consisted of pumping up top tier skills and then using the remaining points to pump them up further... skill such as FO and Meteor.
Anyway, RE the 1 Point skills, and Overpowered skills, as Sol said, 1 point skills will now only be able to accept 1 point, so not a waste, and Overpowered skills will always be in games such as this, just due to the fact that getting 100% perfect balance is nigh on impossible.
ya kno what im too drunk
I'll take your word for it but I am pretty damn sure the new system ruined it, skills lost purpose to me. people cahanged too, more aggressive or something, used to be more playful, maybe it was just me, lots of people didn't like the change though, i know that for sure.
Not everyone is an hardcore Korean gamer, some people actually have fun playing this game, and enjoy skills such as Grim Ward, Hydra, Poison Nova, Potion find, Immolation Arrow, Poison Dagger, and the such...
Do you consider Poison Nova/Dagger, Hydra are useless skills? I think you didn't even understand my first post. However I can say a couple of words about Immolation Arrow and such. Immolation->Fire->Exploding Arrows ; Ice->Freezing->Cold Arrows ; Firebolt->Fireball ; Icebolt->Iceblast , .. Those are all similar and one is a bad copycat of the other. What a shame! Please focus yourself on this: Each skill should have its own PERSONALITY, CHARACTERISTIC, STYLE, SELF-RESPECT. Otherwise people would not RESPECT these skills and they will not be COOL.
Seen the new Fear ability from the Witch Doctor? It already exists in D2, it's called Grim Ward. Woohoo.
Now I am sure you didn't even read my first post throughly. Can you understand the difference between a Grim Ward and a "mobile" Grim Ward?
But after synergies were introduced there were more viable options...indeed pumping top tier skills wasn't needed. Blessed Hammer, most OP skill in the game wasn't top tier, Charged Bolt was available at level 1 and would kill Bosses faster than Lightning or Chain Lightning.
Synergies added variety, instead of every sorc using the same Meteor / FO Combination and every Barb using Storm, CCSoQ or CCBoQ and WW, we now have more varied builds.
They added about as much variety that existed before the patch. You went from meteorbing to blizzorbing. You went from frenzying to smiting. The level of quality builds remained the same - the execution of the builds is what you are talking about.
People argued over the finer benefits of adding 5 points into different skills to give boosts to the same skills we've been using since before the patch. No real difference.
Some skills got a face lift, but nothing that synergies allowed. The skills that weren't viable before the patch became viable with or without the synergies. The patch adjusted skills. This made some skills viable, like FoH, and others not very much.
You still didn't see people upping meteor and fireball so they could use firebolt, which is what they tried to do with synergies but didn't. All the patch did was adjust the damage levels of all of the skills and abilities and, instead of investing 20 points into Meteor you'd invest 20 points into Meteor, 20 points into fireball, 20 points into fire bolt, 20 points into fire mastery, and then the remainder into infero for a meteor build.
I now play with friends on Open Battle.net, playing only with hardcore lvl9 characters. We have hacked charms with -100% exp gained so we make sure we don't gain any more experience, and we try to get as far in the game as we can. We're currently trying to pass Travincal. An army of lvl 9 players trying to pass Travincal. How did we get here without dying? Using all those useless skills of course! Inner Sight, Find Potion (most useful skill to get healed), Howl... Oh yeah, Howl, this is your "mobile" Grim Ward.
Poor dude, with every word you write you confirm my opinions. Blizzard does not even consider making D3 the very anticipated mod-friendly game. How can you even consider they will care open Bnet and hacked chars? Shame on you. Please stop troliing around the forum. Highest priority for Blizzard is Story, Single Player, Multi Player and stop cheating on Bnet. This thread directly relates to certain issues for the awesomeness! expected from the game. Your edited chars and hacked gameplay will not be considered by Blizzard. Now go play around with your lvl9 freaks and stop being lame around!
Do you consider Poison Nova/Dagger, Hydra are useless skills? I think you didn't even understand my first post. However I can say a couple of words about Immolation Arrow and such. Immolation->Fire->Exploding Arrows ; Ice->Freezing->Cold Arrows ; Firebolt->Fireball ; Icebolt->Iceblast , .. Those are all similar and one is a bad copycat of the other. What a shame! Please focus yourself on this: Each skill should have its own PERSONALITY, CHARACTERISTIC, STYLE, SELF-RESPECT. Otherwise people would not RESPECT these skills and they will not be COOL.
This sounds exactly like what the devs have been saying when they talk about skills and classes. Which is great.
People worry too much, lol
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Ranger - Ranged Weapon Mastery (fire a bow or javelins like a machine gun!), Traps (MK style!), Pets (lions, tigers, and bears oh my!) - physical damage based
Demonologist - Bone Spells (Necro style!), Avatar (shapeshift into a demon!), Furies (evil spirits that hang around you, giving party bonuses) - mix of physical damage and magic
LEAP ATTACK!!!!! PLAGUE OF TOADS!!!!!
SLOW TIME!!!!!
The only thing I agree with here is the essential skills such as Battle Orders. Its true, having a skill than doubles the whole party's life is just untouchable, everyone will always spend 20 points in it. It either needs to be removed, or changed. Say, if instead of getting 100% life you only got 35%, it would make you wonder "Hmmm is 35% more life worth the loss of power?" And thats what makes skills fun! If everything is balanced nicely, it just depends on what kind of player you are, which in turn makes up for much more varied gameplay
This is why they are putting those different limits on the skills. Some skills on need one point, some some skills would just be too powerful if you could level them up all of the way.
Do you consider Poison Nova/Dagger, Hydra are useless skills? I think you didn't even understand my first post. However I can say a couple of words about Immolation Arrow and such. Immolation->Fire->Exploding Arrows ; Ice->Freezing->Cold Arrows ; Firebolt->Fireball ; Icebolt->Iceblast , .. Those are all similar and one is a bad copycat of the other. What a shame! Please focus yourself on this: Each skill should have its own PERSONALITY, CHARACTERISTIC, STYLE, SELF-RESPECT. Otherwise people would not RESPECT these skills and they will not be COOL.
Now I am sure you didn't even read my first post throughly. Can you understand the difference between a Grim Ward and a "mobile" Grim Ward?
That's right. D2 was flawed in this sense. No skill should be useless. It's just a broken system.
And what was up with consecutive skills that were very similar, with the latter ones being more powerful. Wtf is the point of having the lower ones? Oh, synergy...lame.
STUPID implementation.
We need unique and self-sufficient skills that are usefull in different scenarios. The player choosing these skills chooses them according to their playing style and HOW they want to achieve their goal.
Must Skill: Battle Orders. I haven't seen a Barb. guide without pumping this skill. In fact when you create a Barb. you start with 20 less skill points. Why? Because you MUST maximise BO. Where is the fun with that?
A few examples of 1 Point Wonders: Battle Command, Sorc Cold Shields, Teleport, Static Field, Amplify Damage, Decrepify, Redemption, ...
A few examples of Useless Skills: Most of Necro curses, Potion/Item Find and Grim Ward, Inner Sight, Shadow Warrior, Thorns Aura, ...
In D2, half of the skills were useless or/and 1 Pt. wonders. They seem to me styleless, dishonorable, worthless skills who lack self-respect. This is not cool. Each skill should have its own usage and must be worthwhile to spend 20 skill points. This is the big deal in D3. Replace useless skills with charming skills and make 1 Pt. wonders more stylish so that we have to trade-off between them.
What's the Big Deal of D3?: http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9462
No Must/1Pt. Wonder/Useless Skills in D3: http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11299
Heavens in Dark Style?:http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11312
Item Finding Mechanism should change:http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10736
Hellforge: Forging a passion for video games.
Before synergy we saw builds that pretty much consisted of pumping up top tier skills such as FO and Meteor.
After synergy we saw builds that pretty much consisted of pumping up top tier skills and then using the remaining points to pump them up further... skill such as FO and Meteor.
Pick your poison.
I'll take your word for it but I am pretty damn sure the new system ruined it, skills lost purpose to me. people cahanged too, more aggressive or something, used to be more playful, maybe it was just me, lots of people didn't like the change though, i know that for sure.
Do you consider Poison Nova/Dagger, Hydra are useless skills? I think you didn't even understand my first post. However I can say a couple of words about Immolation Arrow and such. Immolation->Fire->Exploding Arrows ; Ice->Freezing->Cold Arrows ; Firebolt->Fireball ; Icebolt->Iceblast , .. Those are all similar and one is a bad copycat of the other. What a shame! Please focus yourself on this: Each skill should have its own PERSONALITY, CHARACTERISTIC, STYLE, SELF-RESPECT. Otherwise people would not RESPECT these skills and they will not be COOL.
Now I am sure you didn't even read my first post throughly. Can you understand the difference between a Grim Ward and a "mobile" Grim Ward?
What's the Big Deal of D3?: http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9462
No Must/1Pt. Wonder/Useless Skills in D3: http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11299
Heavens in Dark Style?:http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11312
Item Finding Mechanism should change:http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10736
They added about as much variety that existed before the patch. You went from meteorbing to blizzorbing. You went from frenzying to smiting. The level of quality builds remained the same - the execution of the builds is what you are talking about.
People argued over the finer benefits of adding 5 points into different skills to give boosts to the same skills we've been using since before the patch. No real difference.
Some skills got a face lift, but nothing that synergies allowed. The skills that weren't viable before the patch became viable with or without the synergies. The patch adjusted skills. This made some skills viable, like FoH, and others not very much.
You still didn't see people upping meteor and fireball so they could use firebolt, which is what they tried to do with synergies but didn't. All the patch did was adjust the damage levels of all of the skills and abilities and, instead of investing 20 points into Meteor you'd invest 20 points into Meteor, 20 points into fireball, 20 points into fire bolt, 20 points into fire mastery, and then the remainder into infero for a meteor build.
SSDP.
Poor dude, with every word you write you confirm my opinions. Blizzard does not even consider making D3 the very anticipated mod-friendly game. How can you even consider they will care open Bnet and hacked chars? Shame on you. Please stop troliing around the forum. Highest priority for Blizzard is Story, Single Player, Multi Player and stop cheating on Bnet. This thread directly relates to certain issues for the awesomeness! expected from the game. Your edited chars and hacked gameplay will not be considered by Blizzard. Now go play around with your lvl9 freaks and stop being lame around!
What's the Big Deal of D3?: http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9462
No Must/1Pt. Wonder/Useless Skills in D3: http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11299
Heavens in Dark Style?:http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11312
Item Finding Mechanism should change:http://www.diablofans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10736
This sounds exactly like what the devs have been saying when they talk about skills and classes. Which is great.
People worry too much, lol
Demonologist - Bone Spells (Necro style!), Avatar (shapeshift into a demon!), Furies (evil spirits that hang around you, giving party bonuses) - mix of physical damage and magic
LEAP ATTACK!!!!!
PLAGUE OF TOADS!!!!!
SLOW TIME!!!!!
This is why they are putting those different limits on the skills. Some skills on need one point, some some skills would just be too powerful if you could level them up all of the way.
no, i didnt
That's right. D2 was flawed in this sense. No skill should be useless. It's just a broken system.
And what was up with consecutive skills that were very similar, with the latter ones being more powerful. Wtf is the point of having the lower ones? Oh, synergy...lame.
STUPID implementation.
We need unique and self-sufficient skills that are usefull in different scenarios. The player choosing these skills chooses them according to their playing style and HOW they want to achieve their goal.
More Diablo Less Wow... IMO